Newsgroup comp.cad.autocad 46737

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>I am sure many of us in this newsgroup have had worked on complicated
>drawings in various discipline.   I am quite sure however that you could
>effectively present your drawings without getting into the hassle of PS.
>Randy, I challenge you that your present your details in PS without
having
>to re-draw the same layout and you will see how the program crawls.
I believe that using PS to present 2D details at a larger scale is a gross
mis-use of the feature. But, if you desire to do so, go to PS available
mode (TILEMODE 0) to set viewport status only, set TILEMODE to ONE to
actually draw the plans sections and details.  Toggling the TILEMODE at
the start of the editting session and back and the end of the session
eleminates the problems you have encountered.
The intent of PS/MS was to show different views of a 3D model, top, front,
side, etc. and to annotate such.  I challenge you to do that WITHOUT
PS/MS.
>I find it surprising that USTN could not make a simple angular dimension.
Usta uses what it calls UOR (Units Of Resolution) sort of like
connect-the-dots. Elements can only start and stop on a dot (UOR).  There
is a maximum number of these dots available (called the drawing plane), so
the finer tou set your UOR the smaller area you have available to use.  A
courser setting for UOR gives a larger drawing plane but drastically
reduces accuracy.
MY PET TEST:
Active Angle = 35
UOR   -  Master Units = 1 ; Sub Units = 12 ; Postional Units = 1000
This translates to 1/1000 of an inch accuracy, total UOR = 12000
Angular display setting of Deg/Min/Sec.
Using ANY Rel. of Usta (incl 95), and using ANY method of placing lines
(incl. ACCUDRAW) place a line 3'-3 5/16" long, from XY=0,0 at 35deg.  Then
place another with AA=0, from XY=0,0.
Then using the DIMENSION ANGLE BETWEEN LINES Tool, dimension the angle
between the two lines.  The resulting dimension changes, depending on
where the lines are selected, and can be off as much as 20-30 sec.  Usta
is INCAPABLE of providing a dimension of 35deg00min00sec. 
Sorry for the length,
Randy

>PS is only a good tool in theory and concept.  In practice, remain in MS.
>Quoting on the articles posted, it makes plotting easier.
If that is ALL you are using PS for, yuo have missed the point.  PS makes
it possible to show different views of a 3D model on the same drawing.
It can also be used, in conjunction with XREF,to show enlarged areas on
different drawings (e.g. one large plant map model, XREF'ed into several
DWG's, each with a viewport zoomed into a different part of the plant. 
Edit one model, 10 DWG's are changed) 
>With a moderate size drawing (1MB) and 4 vports, Autocad should be able
to
>handle the load with ease.
My old P60 handles 4-8MB files with 4-8 Viewports with ease.
>Autodesk should be publishing a manual about "PS_tricks of the trade" so
we
>could get around its ineffectiveness.
Depending on your TRADE the TRICKS will be different, but, it is usually
'better' to build and edit model with TILEMODE set to 1 and use TILEMODE
set to 0 for setting up viewports and plotting.  
Randy

KEN COX (kennethcox@arlington.net) wrote:
: Thirmal Magal wrote:
: > 
: > Hello,
: > 
: > Try Ashlar Drawingboard 2D, which includes electrical symbols like
: > resistors, switches, transistors, capacitors, diodes and transformers.
: > Visit Ashlar's DrawingBoard 2D web page at http://www.drawingboard.com for
: > a tour of the CAD program.
: > 
: > Thirmal Magal
: > 
: > In article ,
: > rbarnes@postbox.acs.ohio-state (ralphus) wrote:
: > 
: > > I have a father that wants an electrical engineering cad program (for win
: > > 3.1 or dos) for xmas.  I know a lot about music and sound software but I
: > > don't have the faintest idea of what is out there in the realm of cad.  I
: > > have only $140 to spend and need something that will let him draw diagrams
: > > of circuit boards and such.  It doesn't have to be fancy, it just has to
: > > have symbols for capacitors and resistors etc.  I have looked around at
: > > computer software stores and just received blank looks from the workers
: > > (go figure).  If anyone can e-mail me a recomendation for an appropriate
: > > cad it will be much appreciated.  If you also have information on how to
: > > contact the company to order the software that will be doubly appreciated.
: > >
: > > Thanx in advance.
: > >
: > > rbarnes@postbox.acs.ohio-state.eduYou might also consider schemactic and PCB Layout software such as 
: WinDraft Schematics and WinBoard PCB Layout by IVEX. 
: (http://www.ivex.com)

XSales wrote:
> 
> PS is only a good tool in theory and concept.  In practice, remain in
> MS.   Quoting on the articles posted, it makes plotting easier.
> 
> With a moderate size drawing (1MB) and 4 vports, Autocad should be
> able to handle the load with ease.
> 
> Autodesk should be publishing a manual about "PS_tricks of the trade"
> so we could get around its ineffectiveness.
I agree with Randy. PS has some excellent functions.

Does anybody have any references to an existing Autolisp/ADS newsgroup?

I use "solprof" to get my views off my 3d model

>I use "solprof" to get my views off my 3d model
Then you lose associativity with the model, updates to the model are not
reflected in your view. Sounds like double editting to me, with twice the
chance for a typo.
Randy

David E. Gonsalves wrote:
> 
> We have several Summa Microgrid tablets in use with WIN95/R13c4 on 486-66
> machines, all of them have at least 32 MB RAM, and most have 64.  I've
> downloaded and installed the latest drivers from the Calcomp/Summagraphics
> web site.  My problem is the flicker and hesitation that seems to have come
> about with R13 in general, and these Summa tablets in particular.  You have
> to "row" the puck to get it to move where you want it, and the cursor just
> vanishes for seconds at a time (in AutoCAD).  None of these things is
> overly detrimental, but they are incredibly irritating to deal with all the
> time.  The tablets work OK in Windows except for the "rowing" effect, and
> are set in AutoCAD as WINTAB compatible digitizers.  I've set the data rate
> to max, the sensitivity to about 80-90% (if you set it lower the "rowing"
> just gets worse), the tracking is set to relative using the whole tablet,
> and these are all 4 button pucks.  I have an Hitachi tablet that exhibits
> some of these traits, but nowhere near the irritation level of the Summas.
> Our Calcomp tablets don't have this problem.  In R12 you could fiddle with
> the CFIG386 settings and settle out the cursor, but R13 doesn't seem to
> have a similar facility.
> Does anyone have a solution or suggestion?
> 
> TIA
> 
> David E. Gonsalves, LSIT
> delliottg@olywa.net
I'm having the same problem with my SummaIII in Acad R13 for Win NT
4.0.  I contacted Calcomp/Summagraphics and they said the last set of
driver updates was done hastily prior to the merger and they are working
on a fix.  You're right though, it is a pain in the arse.

Dave Thomas wrote:
> 
> Has anyone found a text editor or whatever that will fully justify text?
> I would like to insert notes and specifications (which usually take a
> full sheet themselves) and have the clean appearance of a word
> processor.  I'd rather let the plotter do the work rather than mess with
> the Xerox machine and stick-back mylar.
Hi Dave,
When you say fully justify text, do you mean the text is aligned both
left and 
right, and the spaces between characters increases proportionaly?  If so
I don't
believe it is possible in autocad, because acad dosn't have proportional
text.
Sorry,
John Lute
Delatite Design
Melbourne Australia

In article <01bbf429$2c2cf180$18645859@TAR.NORLIGHT>, "Trevor says...
>
>
>How do you create GIf files from autocad drawings?  I configured a plotter
>to plot the GIF files, but after I do this I cant find the GIF file.  I am
>trying to use this for animated drawings which only take GIF files.  Any
>help would be great, this is really bugging me!  Thanks in advance. 
>tar@norlight.com
>
Hi
You can use the command "saveimg" or from the tools pull down menu
choose image and then save to create a GIF file in R13c4.
Regards
Sudheer O
-- 
Sudheer O         |Dr. DWG Products |http://www.cswl.com 
sudhee@cswl.com   |OCX, Library and |1015 East Hillsdale 
Tel :(415) 3722900|Viewers for DWG  |Boulevard, Suite 208
Fax :(415) 5778451|(R12 & R13) files|Foster City CA 94404

We have recently come across an apparent problem whereby one user opening 
a drawing does not get a message to say that the drawing is already in use 
by another user. File locking *is* switched ON on both machines. It only 
seems to happen on one or two particular machines.
These PC's are running R13c4 under NT3.51.
I think I've seen messages about this in the group before, but I think 
that, like others, I believed that the poster hadn't really got file 
locking switched on! Now I have seen it myself, I wonder if it's a problem 
with Autocad.
Paul Taylor, Computer Systems Manager
WSP Consulting Engineers, Tadworth, Surrey, UK.
http://www.wspgroup.com/

TWIMC
    A interesting allegation has been made on this newsgroup (i.e. Not
comp.cad.microstation) that Microstation does not accurately measure,
place, or dimension angles. The allegation is that Microstation uses
a routine the same as a video screen uses to draw, i.e. pixels. The 
claim is if the graphics falls off that pixel, you loose your accuracy.
Let me explain what is really happening here.
    Microstation uses a integer based design plane, I will not dispute
that. What is missing in this allegation, is that Microstation also
uses a concept called "Working Units". These working units defines
the accuracy of the information in the design file.
    An example is in order here. If the working units are set to
	Subunits  = 12
        Pos units = 8000
then the accuracy of the file is 1/(12*8000) or 1/96,000 of a unit
(be it feet, meters, cows, etc.). To dimension, draw, or measure a
angle to the nearest second, you only need a accuracy of 1/3600 (60*60),
therefore you have thirty times the accuracy you need. If you require
more accuracy, then you up the working units. For 1/10,000,000 accuracy
(i.e. 0.00000001) then set the working units accordingly. A seasoned
Microstation user should be able to grasp this concept.
   This anology is the same as a computer works. On a computer we deal
ONLY in 0 and 1. Binary and Hexadecimal numbering is in INTEGER units.
The FPU on your computer and other software routines do the calculation
of the Floating Point number for you. If Microstation was as been
accused, then Microstation uses would not need a Floating Point Unit or
Math Coprocessor on their computer. This is not the case. 
    I DO NOT post this here to convince anyone that Microstation is
better than ACAD. The purpose is to educate a group of people that
might of been told half of the story.
P.S. Maybe the person who made this accusation, would monitor the
     comp.cad.microstation newsgroup also, they would realize that
     their accustations only concern them. I do not see this problem
     on that newsgroup.
Sincerely;
Jerry Walter

Mike Wallace  wrote:
>I have a new computer with windows NT 3.51 on it.
>(free 4.0 upgrade on the way)  I installed a new
>version of R13 c4, now when I first go into AutoCAD
>& pick the pulldown "file" menu & try to pick one 
>of the last four dwgs. I worked on, I get a dialog 
>box that says "save the active document with a new 
>name" my only option at this point is to hit 
>the "OK" button, after that it goes back to the 
>active or unnamed dwg.  It keeps on doing this like 
>it is stuck in a loop, my only option is to do a 
>"file" "open" & manually pick the dir. & dwg. that 
>I want to work on.  
>
>I am new to NT 3.51 & c4, previously used win 3.x & 
>c3 w/ no problems.
>
>Any help would be appreciated !
>
>                             Mike Wallace
Mike,
There are a couple solutions available.
First, I think if you get the R13C4a patch it may fix the problem.
Second, edit the AutoCAD icon in Program Manager.  In the command line
box add a startup drawing name at the end.  Something like the
following,
C:\R13\WIN\ACAD.EXE DRAWING1
Now, when you double click on the icon, AutoCAD loads and titles the
new drawing, "DRAWING1".  This should allow you to use of the most
recently used file list.  You can put anything in place of "DRAWING1".
I think this is what I did at work as a work around.  I may be a
little off, but it should at least point you in the right direction.
Good Luck,
Brian Cranston
cranston@infinet.com

>>    A interesting allegation has been made on this newsgroup (i.e. Not
comp.cad.microstation) that Microstation does not accurately measure,
place, or dimension angles. The allegation is that Microstation uses
a routine the same as a video screen uses to draw, i.e. pixels. The 
claim is if the graphics falls off that pixel, you loose your accuracy.<<
Pixels were never discussed when talking about Msta INACCURACY.  The
connect-the-dot method employed by Msta is it's own creation having
nothing to do with graphic resolution.
>> What is missing in this allegation, is that Microstation also
uses a concept called "Working Units". These working units defines
the accuracy of the information in the design file.<<
This is not missing in the allegation, this IS the allegation
>>    An example is in order here. If the working units are set to
	Subunits  = 12        Pos units = 8000
then the accuracy of the file is 1/(12*8000) or 1/96,000 of a unit
(be it feet, meters, cows, etc.). To dimension, draw, or measure a
angle to the nearest second, you only need a accuracy of 1/3600 (60*60),
therefore you have thirty times the accuracy you need.<<
It's interesting you use 8000 as a positional unit setting. Out-of-the-box
Msta sets it to 1000. Most people don't have a clue this setting controls
accuracy and don't reset it. The result is thousands of files with a
setting that promotes inaccuracy. Thousands of drawings, cells, and seed
files that must be modified and scaled to a finer resolution.
>> A seasoned Microstation user should be able to grasp this concept.<<
The concept is easily grasped. The question is, why would a $3000 CAD
program lead its users into a built-in INACCURACY? 
>>    I DO NOT post this here to convince anyone that Microstation is
better than ACAD. The purpose is to educate a group of people that
might of been told half of the story.<<
Your half of the story left out the fact that many 3rd party programs
don't understand this built-in flaw either.  Several high-dollar programs
we have reviewed recently, use MU-SU-PU settings of 1-10-100 or 1-12-100
making angular dimensioning impossible.
A quick survey of users at the local Msta Users group showed that most
drop status and edit the error out of the dimension.
>>Maybe the person who made this accusation, would monitor the
comp.cad.microstation newsgroup also, they would realize that
their accustations only concern them. I do not see this problem
on that newsgroup.<<
I brought this problem to that newsgroup several weeks ago, hoping to get
some trick or help or something from the Bentley guys (Angular Dimen???).
The result was very disappointing.  Long tiraids on the advantages of
MU-SU-PU ?? and people explaining the connect-the-dot concept, but no REAL
help with existing client stds.
Everyone, incuding you and the Bentley Bros., want to explain away the
problem without admitting it exists. Until a sensible solution is offered
to REPAIR existing files and cells, I continue to bring it up every time
someone on the ACAD N/Gs tells someone to use Microstation.
Randy

Darren Young wrote:
> 
> In article <01bbf72f$77104860$57bea1ce@legend>, asales@erols.com says...
> > I am sure many of us in this newsgroup have had worked on complicated
> > drawings in various discipline.   I am quite sure however that you could
> > effectively present your drawings without getting into the hassle of PS.
> 
> PS is not for everyone.  There are places when it is better to use than
> others.  You shouldn't think of PS as a presentation tool, rather a
> productivity tool.  It also allows you to save a lot of disk space.
> 
> PS is like any tool.  It works well in some situations and not very well
> in others.  A hammer can't do everything after all.
> 
> I don't use paperspace very often, but there are times when I do, that
> using just MS would be a waste of time.  An example of this would be one
> project that we are working on right now.  PS used in conjunction with
> Xref'ing allows me to make a change on just one drawings, and have 10
> other drawings be automaticaly updated.  There's no way, anyone can say
> that updating 10 drawings individualy is more productive than updating 1.
> Yes, maybe the drawing might load a little slower but loading and
> changing 10 drawings isn't really that zippy of an operation.
> 
> Later,
> --
> Y-------------------------------------------------------------------+
> | Darren J. Young                 | Minnesota CADWorks, Inc.        |
> |                 dyoung@mcwi.com | P.O. Box 7293                   |
> |       76341.3053@compuserve.com | St. Cloud, Minnesota 56302-7293 |
> |             http://www.mcwi.com | Phone: 1-320-654-9053           |
> | CAD/CAM/CNC - Drafting Design Customization Training Programming  |
> 0,0-----------------------------------------------------------------X
> Email addresses not to be sold or used for unsolicited advertizments.
I haven't seen anyone mention the use of the MAXACTVP variable to 
control the number of active, and therefore regenerating, viewports.
-- 
|   Walt Rook
|   CADD Systems Administrator
|   System Planning Corporation
|   Code 224.4
|   Goddard Space Flight Center
|   Greenbelt, Maryland 20771

The reason they're doing this is because many people were
able to get R13 at a very low price by purchasing a used
license of an earlier release, and taking advantage of the 
low price to upgrade to R13 from *any* previous release.
Hence, all AutoCAD licenses became an extremely valueable 
commodity, and were in greater demand than the new product.
It got to the point where some were actually making a good
living just purchasing licenses, upgrading them to R13, 
and reselling them for significantly less than what AutoCAD
dealers were getting for new product.
Unfortunately, many people feel that most AutoCAD dealers 
have outlived their usefulness, are incompetent, and of 
little help in solving their problems. 
Most dealers want to sell their customers support services
at a premium, but the sad fact is that most of the 'support' 
services that customers require is a manifestation of the
all of the defects that Autodesk has chosen to leave in the 
product, to save money.
-- 
/*******************************************************/ 
/*   Tony Tanzillo     Design Automation Consulting    */
/*    Expert AutoCAD Programming and Customization     */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*      Co-Author of Maximizing AutoCAD R13 and        */
/*        Maximizing AutoLISP for AutoCAD R13          */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*           tony.tanzillo@worldnet.att.net            */
/*                tonyt@compuserve.com                 */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*   http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/tonyt    */
/*******************************************************/
Dave Jones  wrote in article
<32caa61e.8148557@news.wco.com>...
> On Tue, 31 Dec 1996 10:13:34 -0600, dyoung@mcwi.com (Darren Young)
> wrote:
> 
> >>   You may not be aware that Autodesk recently began enforcing the
> >> "non-transferrable" part of the AutoCAD license.  The current policy
is
> >> that you *CANNOT* transfer a license except in cases of the license
> >> holder's death or when one company buys another (although they say
they may
> >> consider transfers for other reasons on a case-by-case basis).
> >
> >Interesting news.  So in other words, Autodesk has pretty much scrapped 
> >their license transfer policy that they once had in place.
> >
> >I wonder if this was a result of companies "Buying Used AutoCAD. Any 
> >Version".  There use to be posts here from a couple.  I would only 
> >imagine that for a few hundred you could pick up r10, upgrade the
license 
> >and sell r13 at a much higher profit.
> >
> >Sincerely,
> >-- 
> >Y-------------------------------------------------------------------+
> >| Darren J. Young                 | Minnesota CADWorks, Inc.        |
> >|                 dyoung@mcwi.com | P.O. Box 7293                   |
> >|       76341.3053@compuserve.com | St. Cloud, Minnesota 56302-7293 |
> >|             http://www.mcwi.com | Phone: 1-320-654-9053           |
> >| CAD/CAM/CNC - Drafting Design Customization Training Programming  |
> >0,0-----------------------------------------------------------------X
> >Email addresses not to be sold or used for unsolicited advertizments.
> 
> So, you mean to tell me that the $3000.00 that I spent for a second
> copy of AutoCAD R13 for an employee rather than just duplicating my
> existing copy on his machine was $3000.00 down the drain?? The
> employee is now gone and I am in the process of selling my 2nd copy,
> at a lot less than $3000.00 I might add, and your telling me that
> Autodesk will not allow me to transfer the license? So, it's like the
> people who support Autodesk's antipiracy program are going to get
> f____d along with the nodogooders?? I think that I'm calling my
> attorney!! And then switching to Microstation!!!!!
> 
> *$#+*$ grrrrrr
> 
> 
> Dave Jones ddp@awwwsome.com
> from lovely downtown Burney, CA
> 

(defun makelambda (fargs body)
   (cons 'lambda (append (list fargs) body))
)
(defun ProgL (fargs body)
   (apply (makelambda fargs body) nil)
)
(setq *formal-args* '(/ a b c)
(ProgL *formal-args* 
   '(
      (setq a 1 b 2 c 3)
      (princ 
         (strcat 
            "\nLocal values: A = " (itoa a)
            "  B = " (itoa b)
            "  C = " (itoa c)
         )
      )
      (princ)
   )
)
-- 
/*******************************************************/ 
/*   Tony Tanzillo     Design Automation Consulting    */
/*    Expert AutoCAD Programming and Customization     */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*      Co-Author of Maximizing AutoCAD R13 and        */
/*        Maximizing AutoLISP for AutoCAD R13          */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*           tony.tanzillo@worldnet.att.net            */
/*                tonyt@compuserve.com                 */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*   http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/tonyt    */
/*******************************************************/
Mettle1  wrote in article
<19970102004900.TAA27247@ladder01.news.aol.com>...
>   I would like to set a global symbol, containing say 40 variables, to be
> used as the "argument-list" to the defun statement. Then when I write a
> program, I would use variables defined only in the global symbol, and I
> would not have to make a list of local variables. (defun c:XXX
(predefined
> local variables)  expr )  Isn t the argument-list just a list? (defun sym
> argument-list expr .) I can t figure out how to do it. Here s what I
> thought would work.
> 
> ;; make symbol called GLOBAL, setup with 3 symbols I want to use as local
> variables for all lisp commands.   
> Command: (setq GLOBAL (list '/ 'A 'B 'C))
> (/ A B C)
> Command: !global
> (/ A B C)
> Command: (type global)
> LIST
> 
> ;;OK, so GOBAL is a list (/ A B C), looks like what I want, but when I
try
> to feed it to defun:
> 
> Command: (defun c:Z GLOBAL (setq A (getpoint)))
> Error: bad argument type*Cancel*
> Command: (defun c:Z 'GLOBAL (setq A (getpoint)))
> C:Z
> Command: z
> Error: incorrect number of arguments to a function*Cancel*
> Command: (eval 'GLOBAL)
> (/ A B C)
> Command: (defun c:Z (eval 'GLOBAL) (setq A (getpoint)))
> C:Z
> Command: z
> Error: incorrect number of arguments to a function*Cancel*
> I m trail & erred out. Can this be done?
> 
> Bruce Cox, METTLE GROUP tool design.
> 
> 
> 

There's no way to select a directory with AutoCAD proper,
and there's no way to determine if a directory exists without
creating a file in it (but AutoLISP doesn't allow you to
delete the file afterwards).
If you're talking R13 for Windows, then you would probably
want to pick up a copy of Maximizing AutoCAD R13. Included
wih it, is the Maximizing AutoCAD Windows Runtime Extension
which adds AutoLISP functions that will let you access the
the "Browse For Folder" dialog box (the same one that you 
use when you choose "Browse..." button on the Windows95/NT4 
Find: dialog box to select the folder to start searching in).
MAWin.ARX also has a (FileExists) function that allows you
to determine if a directory exists.
-- 
/*******************************************************/ 
/*   Tony Tanzillo     Design Automation Consulting    */
/*    Expert AutoCAD Programming and Customization     */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*      Co-Author of Maximizing AutoCAD R13 and        */
/*        Maximizing AutoLISP for AutoCAD R13          */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*           tony.tanzillo@worldnet.att.net            */
/*                tonyt@compuserve.com                 */
/* --------------------------------------------------- */
/*   http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/tonyt    */
/*******************************************************/
John Loeffler  wrote in article
...
> 
> Two questions related to directory names ...
> 
> 1. Are there any AutoLISP functions which provide a dialog box 
> for a user-specified directory, similar to the method of using (getfiled)
> to retrieve the name of a user-specified file? 
> 
> I need an AutoLISP-accessible function which:
>   - Provides a dialog box interface for selecting directories. 
>   - Has features similar to (getfiled):
>     -- Arguments for a dialog title and a default directory.
>     -- Ability to browse directories and different drives.
>   - Returns a directory name for empty or non-empty directories. 
> 
> ------
> 
> 2. Are there any AutoLISP-accessible functions which check for the
> existence of a
> user-specified directory, similar to the checking performed by either
(getfiled)
> or (findfile) function?
> 
> 
> 
> Post directly or respond to jloef@alumni.engin.umich.edu .
> 
> Thanks,
> 
> John
> 

I recently moved to Windows '95.  I downloaded the updated
program drivers for Summasoft 2.1.  I set up the mouse as Summagraphics
Tablet Proxy Mouse
Driver.  It works fine in all programs as a mouse.  In AutoCAD, I tried
to set it up the same way I had it in Win 3.1, with the Wintab mole
mode.  
	I read in the readme that their program for mole mode requires AutoCAD
R13.  Is there anything that will let me run it all for R12????
        In short I have AutoCAD R12, Win 95 (32 bit FAT), Plenty of hard
disk
space, 24 Mb RAM.
                                                Thanks for the help,
                                                David Miller
                                                quacken@csinet.net
P.S. I did try to ask SummaGraphics, and found that they merged with
Calcomp, so Emailed CalComp.  No Response!

>To dimension, draw, or measure a angle to the nearest second, you only
need a >accuracy of 1/3600 (60*60), therefore you have thirty times the
accuracy you >need.
I missed this bit of magic on my first pass thru your note. And basically
it is not true.
Try this:
   Using any version of Msta
   MU-SU-PU = 1-12-1000 (1/12000 is a lot finer than 1/3600)
   Active Angle = 35
   Dimension read out in Deg-Min-Sec
   Using ANY method for placing lines; key-in,  ACCUDRAW (snicker)
   Place a line 3 -3 5/15  long, from XY = 0,0
   Repeat with Active Angle = 0
   Using the Dimension Between Lines Tool, dimension the angle between the
lines
   Dimension them several times selecting the lines in different places   
   Publish the results on the Newsgroup
Randy