Newsgroup sci.engr.surveying 3660

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Can anyone suggest texts that cover the design of storm water controls
such as ponds berms etc. Also, the location of the supplier where such
texts can be ordered. 
G. Margetto PLS 
Lancaster Pa

On 11/19/96 8:19AM, in message <00009606+000006bb@msn.com>, ANTOINE DAHDAH  wrote:
> From: ALAGHA@msn.com (ANTOINE DAHDAH)
> Subject: WATER FINDING INSTRUMENTS. PLEASE HELP.
> Date: 19 Nov 96 06:19:03 -0800
> Message-ID: <00009606+000006bb@msn.com>
> Path: 
> news.corpcomm.net!news.uoregon.edu!news.acsu.buffalo.edu!dsinc!spool.mu.edu!uwm.edu!www.nntp.primenet.co
> m!nntp.primenet.com!news.bbnplanet.com!cam-news-hub1.bbnplanet.com!tezcat!news.sprintlink.net!news-chi-8
> .sprintlink.net!news.msn.com!msn.com
> Newsgroups: sci.engr.surveying
> Organization: The Microsoft Network (msn.com)
> Lines: 13
> 
> 11/18/1996
> 
> I AM IN SEARCH OF AN UNDER GROUND WATER FINDING INSTRUMENT. I DON'T 
> SEEM TO BE ABLE TO LOCATE ANY MANUFACTURERS OF SUCH AN ITEM. I SAW IT 
> ONCE ON T.V. YET I COULD NOT GET THE PHONE NUMBER FAST ENOUGH. IF YOU 
> HAVE ANY INFOS ABOUT IT. PLEASE E.MAI ME AT ALAGHA@MSN.COM.
> 
> YOUR HELP WILL BE GREATLY APPRECIATED.
> 
> THANK YOU
> 
> TONY D.
>  
--
Good Luck! I can't believe someone has finally figured out how water witching works, and has created some 
sort of device to do it.  Although, I was once a skeptic of water witching, I actually saw it in use, 
when a sewer line needed to be located, for repairs.  The person doing the witching, used two welding 
rods, (the kind used for oxy-acetylene welding, about 24" long), with the end six inches bent at 90°, for 
handles.  He the walked back and forth, holding the rods at waist level, and pointed forward.  When he 
passed over the line, the rods pulled downward, and swung outward, pointing the direction of the line.  
He would mark it, then redo it, approaching from the opposite direction, marking that position as well.  
He dug between the marks, and exactly located the pipe.  I repeated his technique, and arrived at the 
exact same points he had located.
Since then, I have successfully witched many different types of water-bearing structures, for surveys & 
construction, using welding rods, coat hangers, fence wire, or what ever was handy.  I am now a true 
believer, but have not seen or heard of any device, which performs this task.
Let us all know, if you do locate the device.
SAM KING
RLS2222@ILAND.NET

--
We use the "wrapping" method, but not as you described. We sight the backsight direct, then the
foresight direct, then invert the scope, and re-sight the backsight and foresight, writing down all 4
angles.  To adjust and mean the errors we add or subtract the difference from 180°, of the inverted
backsight, from the inverted foresight, then mean the direct foresight angle with the (adjusted) inverted
foresight angle (less 180°). If the difference between the direct foresight and the (adjusted) inverted
foresight, is greater than 06", we re-turn the angles. This has proven to give us E.O.C.'s of over 
1:100,000.
Just in case, here's an example set:  B.S.(direct)    00°00'00"
                                      F.S.(direct)    79°32'48"
                                      B.S.(inverted) 180°00'06"
                                      F.S.(inverted) 259°32'59"
                                                            inverted B.S. error
                                      F.S.(inverted) 259°32'59" - 00°00'06" = 259°32'53" -
                                                   180°00'00" =
                                                    79°32'53" (adjusted)
                                      F.S.(direct)  79°32'48" (unadjusted)
                                      F.S.(mean) =  79°32'50.5"(final angle)
I have never turned multiple sets, since I have had such excellent closures, using one set, as long as I 
follow the 06" minimum spread tolerance, between the two final angles, to be meaned, which is 05", in the 
example I gave.
--
SAM KING
RLS2222@ILAND.NEt

There is a device being marketed as an all purpose locator.
Supposedly it will find anything from water, to iron pins, to
illegal drugs.  It looks like a small transistor radio with an
antenna which pivots on a bearing.
An outfit I work for occasionally purchased one.  It didn't work.
The above posting seems to indicate that the phenomena of
"water witching" is more associated with the talent of the
operator than with any particular tool.
Alan B. Chace, PLS
Bainbridge, New York

Anyone knowing of venders with a product to upgrade a MATRA Traster T1 or
T2 Stereo instrument from a DG30 Platform to a PC based platform please
let me know at one of the following email addresses:
dclowers@usa.net
dclowers@anlt.com

ou81tuu@aol.com wrote:
(snip)
>     Mr. Anderson I appreciate your criticism of my reply. 
(Not a criticism - just a difference of opinion)
(Snip)
> When was the last time >you saw a tie to a house on a ROS or one called out on a legal. 
Last week.
>I'm not >saying that It doesn't happen, I'm just saying that for the year that his  
>sub. was created it seems HIGHLY unlikely.
>   
>       I have found in reading Q. from  home owners on-line that you don't
>always qet the whole story and in the same note, respondents such as
>yourself don't always read over responces with the intent to observe,
>learn and respond but rather read to critique. Again I value your
>criticism, but I would urge you to please re-read the orig. post and my
>responce again.
I believe I understood it all the first time.  I generally read ALL
the postings to this news group.
> 
>        P.S. Experience says very little to me, some of the worst surveys
>that I have retraced were done by surveyor's older than me. So unless you
>started when you were 2 you could be there. ( Just survey humor )
Generally, I agree- lots of folks don't have ten years experience -
they have ONE year ten times.  I hope I don't fall in that category.
>         P.S.S. Reg. in several states ?  Haven't been caught yet ?
Don't really understand the question???  If It's a joke I'll laugh ...
if it's an insult I'll ignore it.
>**********************************
>*        Rick Turner LSIT         *
>*     San Diego California      *
>*                 USA                   *
>*   OU81TUU@AOL.COM     *
>**********************************
Rick, nothing in my post was meant to offend - I just get nervous when
I see someone making statements that seem to imply that it's the final
word, and all there is to the subject.  In the words of a surveyor
much more acomplished than I:  "The contrary may be shown!"
---
papabear@roadrunner.com (Formerly Moosemeat@aol.com)
"It's time to throw all their damn tea in the harbor again!"

TONY D. -
   To find ground-water, I don't think that there is a single neat 
little instrument that will do it.  On TV, you may have seen a dowsing 
stick, which, in my opinion, is junk.  To find ground-water, you should 
have a geologist, preferably one who speciallizes in hydrology.  The 
geologist may do a preliminary search with a magnetometer, and then he 
may do a more detailed search with electrical resistance measuring 
equipment.  There may even be more modern ways.  But get a real 
geologist.
   If the water is in a metal pipe, then you may be able to find the 
pipe with a pipe and cable locator.  They work in various ways, 
generally by coupling RF power into the pipe.  Once you find the pipe, 
then generally you can trace it by using the same instrument in a 
different mode.  It also works on buried electrical wires.
   If the water is in a steel pipe, then you may be able to find the 
pipe with a magnetic locator.  They work in various ways, generally by 
detecting the distortion of Earth's magnetic field caused by the pipe.
   If you bury a new water pipe, then bury durable warning tape in the 
trench, just below the surface.  That warns a digging crew not to cut 
into the pipe.  And if the pipe is plastic, then use alumnium warning 
tape or copper wire of appropriate size.  That allows people to find the 
tape or wire later with a pipe and cable locator.
   I have been through all of these problems in our Boy Scout camp.
   If you are in an area that is served by a commercial utility, then 
ask about an under-ground utility locating service.  In my area, we have 
Underground Service Alert ("USA").  With a few days of warning, they 
come and mark the ground for you, at no charge to you.
                                       Dick Alvarez
                                       alvarez@best.com

Paul Kunkel wrote:
> 
> 
> 
  One major source of
> theodolite error is eccentricity of the trunnion axis, the axis about
> which the scope plunges.  If the trunnion axis is not horizontal, then as
> the scope is tilted, the line of sight will cut a plane which is not
> vertical.  This will lead to angular error, but it is quite possible to
> get a deceitfully good closure in spite of it.
> (snip)
>      Those who read from both sides and use the same instrument every day
> may notice this effect when they reduce notes.  The error will tend to be
> greater on the steep shots, and its sign will depend on whether the
> traverse is running uphill or downhill.
> 
>      Kunkel
In fact taking horizontal circle readings on both faces (transiting)
will not elliminate the effects of a tilted trunnion axis due to plate
bubble missalignment. It is for this reason that for steeply inclined
sights, such as for astronomical observations it is essential to take
plate bubble readings on both faces in order to adjust the observed
horizontal angle between the reference and the sun or star. 
Never-the-less where horizontal and vertical angles are required which
are free of the other systematic errors of horizontal and vertical
collimation, circle eccentricity etc then it is essential to take face
left, face right obs unless the instrument has suitable software,
sensors and calibration techniques to compensate for them automatically.
I would also disagree with the respondent who states that a Bowdich
adjustment is better than a least squares adjustment. while it is true
that the redundency is small, a ls solution will always be better
statistically than any approximate adjustment. Mind you the difference
between the two solutions may well be so small that it does not matter.
In the past Bowdich was used because of the lack of suitable simple ls
adjustment programs but these days there are any number available which
are capable of solving virtually any combination of angular and distance
measurements. 
__________________________________________________________
| Dr Tony Sprent                                          |
| Department of Surveying & Spatial Information Science   |
| University of Tasmania                                  |
| GPO Box 252C Hobart        _--_|\                       |
| Tasmania*                 /      \                      |
| Australia   7001          \_.--._/   )                  |
|                                 *   /                   |
| Phone 61-3-62262106 Fax 61-3-62240282  International    |
|         03-62262106       03-62240282  Australia        |
| email  Tony.Sprent@surv.utas.edu.au                     |
| http://info.utas.edu.au/docs/geomatics/		  |
|_________________________________________________________|

I recently purchased at auction a transit.  It was identified by the
auctioneer as a navigational instrument, but my one semester of
surveying leads me to believe it is a transit.  The only identifying
marks are the words "Stanley" and "London" stamped into the base.
Is anyone familiar with this company?  Are they still in business?  Do
they have a web site?  Do you have their address?
Any information you can provide is appreciated.
Thanks, Christopher Stevens
(ctsteve@ix.netcom.com)

Witching really does work. Any skeptics should just get a demonstration
from someone who knows. It's VERY simple.
Michael Incledon, PE
IWA Engineers
600 The City Parkway West, Suite 300
Orange, CA 92868
michael@iwaengineers.com

In article <328FD5EB.6201@synapse.net> Chris Hall  writes:
>From: Chris Hall 
>Subject: Re: Job prospects for a Survey Technician
>Date: Sun, 17 Nov 1996 22:20:11 -0500
>Alan B. Chace wrote:
>> 
>> In upstate New York, there is practically no demand at all
>> for surveying technicians.  Those few who find jobs can expect
>> to earn $6-$9 an hour.  The work is seasonal and unsteady.  Job
>> security, benefits, vacations, and such are unheard of.
>It's about the same thing in Eastern Ontario. Seems that our general
>part of the world isn't booming right now...
>If you're willing to move out west there is plenty of work from
>what I've heard. I got mail from a guy in Denver and another in
>Pheonix which stated that there is no shortage of jobs for 
>qualified individuals.  
>-- 
>Humans are merely a life support system for their cats.
>=======================================================   
>Chris J. Hall      jkh@synapse.net     Ottawa ON
>Canada                           
>=======================================================
Can't speak for Denver, but unless you are a party chief, with a few years of 
experience as one, you probably won't get more than $9.00/hr in the 
Phoenix-Tucson area.  As a chief of parties with exceptional field and office 
skills, I make appx 35k a year.  We pay our best instrument operators (those 
with very strong data collector skills) about $9.00 to $10.00/hr.
Paul
P.S.  We are contemplating laying off 25% of our field personal.  Seems 
typical in the Tucson area right now.

We recently got rid of an old plotter, and are happily plotting away on
our fancy new HP755CM plotter. We have discovered that the color plots
will fade away when exposed to the air. What we don't know is if the
back ink will do the same, and what sort of shelf life we could expect.
I seem to remember a previous discussion on this topic, and its obvious
implications in regard to survey plats, when these plotters first came
out. Does anyone have direct knowledge and/or experience in this matter?
Has this problem been resolved?  Our cadastral section is rightfully
concerned.....
Thanks in advance,

Subject:      Survey Office Manager
Date:         11/21/96
Newsgroups:   misc.jobs.offered
     Work Schedule       : 40 Hours/week
     Work Location       : Tampa/St. Petersburg Florida
     Qualifications      : Proficient at Autocad and manual drafting.
     Experience          : In addition to Job Description, candidate
should   have experience in field and office surveying procedures
Please respond via e-mail to jjspat@gte.net with  brief resume and
work experience.
All correspondence will be kept confidential.