Newsgroup sci.geo.geology 32636

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	OK, my solar eclipse story:
	I had the good fortune to see the Feb. 26 1979 total eclipse of
the Pacific Northwest of the U.S. from the vantage point of a light
plane flying at 23,000 feet over Bosman Montana. I got connected with
someone at SRI International next door to USGS in Menlo Park Ca, when
I was working there. The person was getting checked out on a Cesna 210,
a six seat single engine aircraft and myself and his flight instructor
and other folks split up the costs and one night's lodging to fly
out to Montana and see the eclipse. We flew to Salt Lake City, spent
the night, flew on to Pocotello Id., refueled, and flew to Bosman where
the controllers had a bunch of people stacked in the airspace.
	I took slides, which came out nondescript, the corona was
over-exposed, but I did see Venus. The best memory I have is what I
saw with my own eyes through binoculars. The colors are what I recall
the most vividly, the magenta of the prommances, and the yellow white
of coronal streamers, which showed up on very few photographs. The
human eye has much greater dynamic range than any film, certaintly of
any at that time.
	I describe what I saw with some pride because I don't have
the best vision, I see only out of my right eye, and only with 20/50
corrected, so I was careful to stop looking right at third contact,
there was no real diamond ring as I recall. One thing I do remember is
that one could actually see a diffuse oval shadown moving off to the
north-east as the umbra moved off towards Canada on that afternoon.
The only disadvantage of  this was that any effects such as shadow
bands could not be seem, but at the West was generally cloudy maybe
noone on the ground saw them anyway. I knew that people were scrambling
around because of the bad weather. Someone I knew what flew up to Oregon
to see the eclipse wound up flying several hundred miles to get a
clear view. He  was kind enough to give me a print of a photo he made.
The ground all around was covered with snow and the weather was
unsettled. I remember that the basin range was covered in cumulus as
we flew straight home. I did get a nice oblique view of Pyramid Lake
in western Navada on that afternoon, though.
Bruce Salem
-- 
!! Just my opinions, maybe not those of my sponsor. !!

Leonard Timmons posted the following to alt.atheism,
>Stix wrote:
>> Atheism is simply the lack of theistic belief.
>What is theism?
Huh? Theism is the belief in god or gods.
Was this a trick question?
Stix
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~
"Like one that on a lonesome road,
Doth walk in fear and dread.
And having once turned round, walks on,
And no more turns his head.
Because he knows, a frightful fiend
Doth close behind him tread."
~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~

In article <500m5r$70m@reader1.reader.news.ozemail.net>, stix@ozemail.com.au (Stix) writes:
>Leonard Timmons posted the following to alt.atheism,
>
>>Stix wrote:
>>> Atheism is simply the lack of theistic belief.
>
>>What is theism?
>
>Huh? Theism is the belief in god or gods.
>
>Was this a trick question?
>
Not really.  I can already guess the next question.  What is god?
Mati Meron			| "When you argue with a fool,
meron@cars.uchicago.edu		|  chances are he is doing just the same"

I have not posted here previously. I do so now to ask for 
information and to invite discussion on the subject of the date of 
the eruption of Thera (more often called Santorini in geology 
circles, I think.) a volcano in the Aegean Sea. The date of the 
Thera eruption has been the subject of a great deal discussion (and 
of debate) in a number of fields, including history, archaeology, 
geology, dendrochronology, and ice core investigations for more than 
two decades now. 
This discussion has recently been stirred up a bit by a paper in 
"Nature," "Anatolian tree rings and the absolute chronology of the 
eastern Mediterranean, "2220-718 BC, Peter Ian Kuniholm, et al. 
(Nature, vol. 381, 27 June, 1996.) Kuniholm is the leader of the 
Aegean Dendrochronology Project at Cornell University. The counter 
position on the subject was given in a review in the same issue by 
Colin Renfrew, "Kings, Tree Rings, and the Old World." Renfrew is 
one of the preeminent archaeologists currently active, and was 
formerly at Cambridge University. 
Very briefly, Thera is a large volcano, roughly mid way between 
Athens, Greece, and Konossos, Crete. It has erupted a number of 
times. One of these eruptions buried extensive ruins of a Bronze Age 
city, very closely related to the Minoian culture of Crete. 
Calibrated radiocarbon dating of short term samples under that 
particular tephra layer give dates of about 1600 BC. 
The cultural remains, in particular pottery and wall paintings, have 
connections with Crete, and with Egypt. Archaeologists and 
historians have been unwilling to accept a date earlier than 1500 BC 
for these connections. This discrepancy is important, to some 
people. If for no other reason, it is one of many disagreements 
between "traditional" and "scientific" dates in the area. An area 
where the traditional dates, based on written, though incomplete 
records and other sources, are stronger than anywhere else. 
Things got a bit more complicated in the mid '80s when Valmore 
Lamarche published a paper which proposed that the eruption of Thera 
could have been responsible for frost damage in California 
bristlecone pines in 1627/8 BC. Similar indications have since been 
found in European tree rings. In addition, several studies of 
Greenland ice cores have found a significant residual of sulfate ion 
at about the same time. 
In the paper mentioned, Kuniholm reports on a new "floating" 
dendrochronology (tree ring) sequence from Anatolia (Turkey.) 
"Floating" because it is not continuous to living trees. This 
sequence was "wiggle matched" by C 14 dating to the bristlecone 
sequence. Ring 854 of this sequence (dated to 1641 +76/-22 BC from 
the radiocarbon) has a remarkable growth anomaly. The largest 
Kuniholm has found in 6500 years of Aegean tree rings. A bit 
unexpectedly, this anomaly is one of *enhanced* growth. 
None the less, Kuniholm proposes that this anomaly is the same event 
seen in California and European tree rings. And, that the growth 
enhancement was due to cold, wet weather in an area that is normally 
hot and dry. He offers further confirmation from an additional, 
smaller anomaly, 470 years later. This matches, within a year, with 
an anomaly noted in European tree rings which has been attributed by 
Baillie to the Hekla 3 eruption in Iceland. (I somehow get the idea 
that there must be some objection to Baillie's conclusion, because 
no one talks about it. But, I can't find out what.)
Renfrew, representing the opposing view, objects to accepting an 
enhanced growth anomaly as the result of a volcanic eruption, and 
proposes that the 1628 event was some other eruption, in Iceland, 
Alaska, or elsewhere. The Thera eruption could then take place at 
some other convenient time, say 1500 BC, and be missing in 
Kuniholm's sequence. Renfrew proposes, and Kuniholm accepts, that 
"definitive confirmation must await the identification of Thera 
eruption products in a dated Ice core, as has now been achieved for 
several more recent eruptions."
The Thera eruption has been estimated to have been a VEI=6 event, 
the same size as Krakatoa among others. I have said that not being 
able to find the evidence of this eruption in the mid east is like 
getting on an elevator and not noticing there is an elephant already 
on it. Renfrew, in my view, is asking us to imagine getting on the 
elevator with an elephant, and getting off with a different 
elephant. And not noticing that there were two of them. 
Is any one else following these developments?  Does any one know 
anything about the status of tephra identification in ice cores? 
Does any one have any opinions on any of this?
Henry Hillbrath
(Cross posted to sci.archaeology.)

Patrick Juola (patrick@gryphon.psych.ox.ac.uk) wrote:
: In article  wn181@news.freenet.victoria.bc.ca (Chris Behnsen) writes:
: >Not at all true.  What about non-linear mathematics?  They involve a 
: >certain amount of imagination, and hardly EVER have any real "rules"?
: "Non-linear mathematics"?  I completed a degree in mathematics and
: only one course could possibly have been described as "linear
: mathematics."  (Intro Lin Alg, which I hated.  Something about a
: terrible lecturer.)  What the hell are you talking about?
Complexity Theory.  otherwise popularily known as CHAOS THEORY.
Non Linear Mathematics is a sort of sub-division to that.:)

James Maynard  wrote:
>	I've just stumbled onto this group & have read all entries (as of 
>8/25) concerning this post, but not one of them mentioned iridium. While 
>very rare on Earth, iridium is found quite commonly in asteroids;  ...
Yes, quite true, and this is indeed one more piece of evidence that
one or more imapcts occurred.
This still leaves the issue of the *effects* of the impact unanswered.
>	Dr. Robert Baker, who I hold in very high regard doesn't believe 
>in the impact theory, but believes instead that dinosaurs evolved into 
>modern day birds. 
That is a *separate* issue.  The vast majority of dinosaur lineages
died out at or before the K-T boundary.  Only some of that those that
had *already* evolved into birds survived (and note, apparently only a
few of the avian lineages survived).
The extinctions occured - the only real question is what caused them.
Even Dr Bakker would agree with this.
The peace of God be with you.
Stanley Friesen

I'm looking for a in-print reference book on the geology of New Zealand 
to use during a trip there this summer.  I would like the book provide a 
general background on the geology and detail specific locations of 
geologic interest.  Any references or specific locations would be 
appreciated!
Betty Evans
BS Geology U of Illinois - 1978

Summary: Need 30m spacing DEMs in Virginia and Maryland along the Potomac
River.  Besides spectrum.xerox.com, what other sources are there?  Need
these for watershed analysis dessertation research: 
Keywords: 30M dem: Virginia: Maryland

ANNOUNCING :
A world symposium called :"After Coal : In search of a sustainable development
 model" on the technical Aftermath of coalfield exploitation will be held :
	from Monday 17 to Friday 21 march 1997,
	at Villeneuve D'Ascq (FRANCE),
	by the Lille University of Science and Technologie, 
At the invitation of :
- the Nord Pas-de-Calais Region, 
- Euracom (Association of Mining Regions of Europe), 
- the European Region of Industrial Technology, 
- Acom France (Association of Mining Communities of France),
- the Association of Mining Communities of Nord Pas-de-Calais,
- the Lille University of Science and Technologie.
Contact : 
         COAL & the ENVIRONMENT 97 Symposium
                Steering Committee
         Conseil Regional Nord-Pas-de-Calais
            7,square Morrisson BP 2035
            59 014 LILLE Cedex FRANCE
             Telephone : (33) 20 60 60 60
                         (33) 20 60 69 53
             Fax :       (33) 20 60 62 00
                         (33) 20 60 69 52
             Telex :     120 049F
For more informations
Christophe TURCK,
or
Pr Francis MEILLIEZ 
UFR des Sciences de la Terre 
Batiment SN5 
Université des Sciences et Technologies de Lille 
59655 Villeuneuve d'Ascq FRANCE 
Phone : (33) 20 43 40 95 
Fax :  	(33) 20 43 49 10 
E.Mail : Francis.Meilliez@univ-lille1.fr
E.Mail : Christophe.Turck@univ-lille1.fr

In article  
wpenrose@interaccess.com (William R. Penrose) writes:
   This is a difference between science and religion.  A religion cannot allow 
   for dissent or change, because its adherents are mainly in search of 
   certainty.  Science must allow it, however reluctantly.
No.  It's irrelevant whether religion @allows@ change; what matters is
the fact that religion @itself@ changes and adapts. Therefore, science
and religion are not different in the respect of change.
Cheers,					I am the God of New York.
Philip Nikolayev			I fart
nikolay@fas.harvard.edu			_The New Yorker_.

meron@cars3.uchicago.edu wrote:
: In article <4vuld5$5b8@pt9201.ped.pto.ford.com>, haley@pt9231.ped.pto.ford.com (Bob Haley) writes:
: >
: >For that matter, Liousville proved (in 1835 I think. don't quote me.) that
: >not all integrable functions have an anti-dervative.  Many folks take this
: >notion out of context as well, if they are even aware of the theorem to
: >begin with (saves a great deal of time if one does not exist).   Oh well,
: >'nuf said.
: >
: Sure saves time.  The only problem is to determine that it really 
: doesn't exist for the specific function you care about.  By the way, 
: where have you been?  Didn't see anything from you for the last few 
: months.
: Mati Meron			| "When you argue with a fool,
: meron@cars.uchicago.edu	|  chances are he is doing just the same"
Hi Mati.  Well, the basic relations in the theorem are usually straight
forward to apply.  I have used this theorem quite a bit.  My intuitive
skills improved dramatically.  I can get a sense about a functions closed-
form integrability pretty quick.  If I have any real doubts, I apply the
theorem.  Anyway......
Regarding my where-abouts, I have been a quiet spectator.  Hoping the
noise, flames, aggressively arrogant flavor to articles would subside a
bit.  Seems to have done that a little.  The thread, "Creation vs Evolu-
tion", was interesting to watch.  It took on the traits of a feeding
frenzy at times.  Good for a chuckle or two.  It was interesting to watch
how the definitons of the words changed to suit the needs of the beliefs,
instead of choosing new words to meet said needs.  In doing so, the level                  
of context switching that I observed was remarkable, by believers and non-
believers alike.  Interesting.
Anyhow, I am here, lurking in the shadows, peering occasionally, out into
the vast chaos called USNET (and doing my job, of course).  We'll keep in
touch for sure.  Sorry for not doing that all this time.
All the best,
Bob Haley
NOTE:  In no way is my employer responsible for any information conveyed
       in THIS post.

Burke J. Minsley wrote:
> that I'd like to look at grad school in geology/geophysics.
> The problem is finding out what professors are doing what projects
> and where they are.If anyone could point me in a good direction,
> I'd appreciate it.  Some listserc groups or web sites would be best.
If you're looking at grad schools in the US and Canada, try the page at
the University of South Dakota.  It has the most complete list of
geology department homepages. 		   
    (http://www.sdgs.usd.edu/esci/geodepts.htm)
If you're interested in Volcanoloy (gratuitous plug for my page! ;-) )
try http://mistral.ere.umontreal.ca/~williamg/Volcprof.html
Good surfing!
	Glyn
------------------------------------------------------------
Glyn Williams-Jones    |    williamg@ere.umontreal.ca
Dept. de Geologie	    UNIVERSITE de MONTREAL
http://mistral.ere.umontreal.ca/~williamg/Arenal/LAVolc.html
http://mistral.ere.umontreal.ca/~williamg/Volcprof.html
	     "De Profundis Ad Astra"
------------------------------------------------------------

Reposting of software availability:
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The user interface is a cursor-driven, spatial motif that is
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This software was designed as a research tool, but it has primarily
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The software is distributed in a freeware manner, so students can
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Check out our web site for more information or e-mail us at
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        THE QUARTERLY JOURNAL OF ENGINEERING GEOLOGY
                        Vol. 29, Part 3                 August 1996
1473    A. Forster & S. C. Forster: Photographic Feature: Troglodyte
dwellings of the Loire Valley, France   193
1404    S. W. C. Au: The influence of joint-planes on the mass strength
of Hong Kong saprolitic soils   199
1364    B. H. Sadagah & Z. _en: Naturally fractured rock mass quality
zonation in Saudi Arabia        205
1442    M. Salih Bayraktutan, J. R. Merefield, P. Grainger, B. M. Evans,
M. Yilmaz & E. Kalkan: Regional gas geochemistry in an active tectonic
zone, Erzurum Basin, eastern Turkey     209
1338    K. R. Onions, K. Whitworth & P. Jackson: Application of
geophysical methods to site investigations at contaminated old colliery
sites   219
1413    M.-G. Angeli, P. Gasparetto, R. M. Menotti, A. Pasuto & S.
Silvano: A visco-plastic model for slope analysis applied to a mudslide
in Cortina d'Ampezzo, Italy
        233
1377*   J. Lamont-Black &  R. N. Mortimore: Determination of the intact
dry density of irregular chalk lumps: a new method      241
1387    S. P. Wright, P. J. Walden, C. M. Sangha & N. J. Langdon:
Observations on soil permeability, moulding moisture content and dry
density relationships   249
1451    M. Price: Discussion on `The Chalk as a karstic aquifer:
evidence from a tracer test at Stanford Dingley, Berkshire, UK' by D.
Banks, C. Davies & W. Davies (QJEG, 28, S31-S38)        257
Book Reviews    259
Erratum 264
Forthcoming papers:
1203    L. Valdeon, M. H. de Freitas & M. S. King: Assessment of  the
quality of building stones using signal processing procedures   est10pp
1446    Abdallah I. Husein Malkawi & K. J. Fahmi: Locally derived
earthquake ground motion attenuation relations for Jordan and
conterminous areas      est12pp
1429    R. C. Carter & A. G. Alkali: Shallow groundwater in the
northeast arid zone of Nigeria  16pp
For further details please contact:
Geological Society Publishing House
Unit 7, Brassmill enterprise Centre
Brassmill Lane
Bath BA1 3JN, UK
Tel: 44 1225 445046 Fax: 44 1225 442836
-- 
Mike Collins

Petroleum Geoscience
http://www.geolsoc.org.uk/pubs/journals/petgeo.htm
Volume 2  Number 3  August 1996
CONTENTS
Sokolov, B. A. Caucasus wedge-thrust structures and oil-gas potential
193
Macgregor, D. S. Factors controlling the destruction or preservation of
giant light oilfields   197
Coutts, S. D., Larsson, S. Y. & Rosman, R. Development of the slumped
crestal area of the Brent Reservoir, Brent Field: an integrated approach
219
Milter, J. & Øxnevad, I. E. I. Spontaneous imbibition in two different
chalk facies    231
Pene ,C. Hydrocarbon generation modelling in the west of the Moesian
Platform, Romania       241
Reinholdtsen, B. Draugen Field development: the role of gravity drainage
and horizontal wells    249
Blunt, M. J., Liu, K. & Thiele, M. R. A generalized streamline method to
predict reservoir flow  259
Ryseth, A. & Ramm, M. Alluvial architecture and differential subsidence
in the Statfjord Formation, North Sea: prediction of reservoir potential
271
For further details please contact:
Geological Society Publishing House
Unit 7, Brassmill enterprise Centre
Brassmill Lane
Bath BA1 3JN, UK
Tel: 44 1225 445046 Fax: 44 1225 442836
-- 
Mike Collins

Global Continental Changes: the Context of Palaeohydrology
Edited by J. Branson (University of Southampton, UK), A.G. Brown
(University of Exeter, UK) & K.J. Gregory (Goldsmiths’ College,
University of London, UK)
Palaeohydrology is the study of changes in the waters of the Earth prior
to continuous monitoring. Knowledge of these changes is important for
the understanding of past and present environmental changes and of the
form of the present-day environment. 
The evolution of the hydrological cycle in response to climatic change
produces a chain of environmental and human consequences - factors that
are becoming more relevant as climate change is predicted. Evidence of
past environmental changes may be used to validate models with which to
predict future change - thus the study of rates, mechanisms and
processes of Late Quaternary hydrological changes is of critical
importance. 
This volume is designed for all who are interested in the hydrological
impacts of climatic change and the contribution that palaeohydrology can
make to the study of these changes. It details recent achievements in
this important field, and provides for prioritizing and guiding future
studies.
•       Details recent advances in palaeohydrological research
•       Case studies from a wide variety of climatic and physical
regions
•       Describes a wide variety of  techniques
•       Discusses the future for palaeohydrological research
Contents
Introduction •  The context of palaeohydrology • Palaeohydrological
reconstruction: advantages and disadvantages • Palaeohydrology and
future climate change • Changes in moisture balance between glacial and
interglacial conditions; influence on carbon cycle processes • Erosion
and sediment yield in a changing environment • Human dimensions of
palaeohydrological change • Discovering Earth’s future in its past:
palaeohydrology and global environmental change • Approaches to
palaeohydrological analysis • Mediterranean, tropical and monsoon
regions • Climate change and flood sensitivity in Spain •
Geochronologies and environmental records of Quaternary fluvial
sequences in  the Guadalope basin, Northeast Spain, based on
luminescence dating • Magnitude and frequency of Holocene palaeofloods
in the southwestern United States: a review and discussion of
implications • The response of geomorphic systems to climatic and
hydrological change during the late glacial and early Holocene in the
humid and sub-humid tropics • Cold regions • Palaeo and historical flood
hydrology, Indian peninsula • A preliminary palaeohydraulic model
applied to Late Quaternary gravel dunes: Altai Mountains, Siberia • Late
Quaternary intra-continental river palaeohydrology and polycyclic
terrace formation: the example of south Siberian river valleys •
Temperate regions • River responses to decadal-scale changes in
discharge regime: the Gila River, SE Arizona • Climatic or anthropogenic
alluviation in Central European valleys during the Holocene • River
response to the last neoglaical (the ‘Little Ice Age’) in northern,
western and central Europe • A future for palaeohydrology • Issues in
scientific co-operation on information sharing: the case of
palaeohydrology • The Past Global Changes (PAGES) Project • Global
continental changes: the context of palaeohydrology
Principal Authors
K.J. Gregory (Goldsmiths’ College, UK)
L. Starkel (Insitute of Geography, Poland)
N.W. Arnell (University of Southampton, UK)
J.M. Adams (King’s College, UK)
D.E. Walling (University of Exeter, UK)
A.G. Brown (University of Exeter, UK)
V.R. Baker (University of Arizona, USA)
G. Benito (Centre de Ciencias Medioambientales, Spain)
I.C. Fuller (University of Wales, Aberystwyth, UK)
Y. Enzel (Hebrew University, Israel)
M.F. Thomas (University of Stirling, UK)
V.S. Kale (Central Washington University, USA)
P.A. Carling (Lancaster University, UK)
A.F. Yamskikh (Laboratory of Paleogeography Pedagogical University,
Russia)
J.M. Hooke (University of Portsmouth, UK)
T. Kalicki (Polish Academy of Sciences, Poland)
B.T. Rumsby (University of Hull, UK)
J. Branson (University of Southampton, UK)
J.R. Pilcher (Queens University, UK)
A.G. Brown (University of Exeter, UK)
•       Geological Society Special Publication No. 115
•       280 pages, hardback, 
        ISBN: 1-897799-69-1,
        September 1996
• List price £59/US$98
Geological Society Publishing House
Unit 7, Brassmill enterprise Centre
Brassmill Lane
Bath BA1 3JN, UK
Tel: 44 1225 445046 Fax: 44 1225 442836
-- 
Mike Collins

Greetings,
I've read (this newsgroup, I think, as well as other places) that one
explanation for survival of birds and mammals after the K/T impact event was
that only a few, perhaps geographically isolated and insulated, lineages 
survived, which then diversified in the early Cenozoic. In other words, birds
and mammals would have been hard hit by extinctions, but a few individuals
managed to survive and carry on the tradition.
However, recent genetic studies (most recent issue of Earth magazine, I believe)
indicate that modern lineages of mammals diverged 100 million years
ago, well before the end of the Cretaceous. The researchers used genetic
material from people (primates), mice (rodents), and cows (ungulates). I think
the researchers found similar results with birds. I can verify the article this
evening if someone wants to know more.
My question. Wouldn't this early diversification of mammals and birds, and hence
the relatively large number of lineages that apparently survived the K/T
boundary, contradict the above conceptual model for extinction and survival
patterns that occurred from an impact?
Thanks,
Jim
Little Rock, AR
Standard opinions, disclaimers are my own.

I have a copy of the source code to Robert Gibbons's software "TREND" to
calculate the Mann Kendall Statistic from small populations.   The code
is listed in the Appendx of Statistical Methods for Groundwater
Monitoring.  Dr. Gibbons freely
distributes the source code but it is Vax Fortran and not Fortran 77
standard.  After several hours of sorting through compiler errors I've not
been able to get it to work on my PC.
Does anyone out there have a compiled version they are willing to e-mail
or snail mail my way?
thanks
Jeff Berk
-- 
web site for Breyer Horses: http://www.netwalk.com/~jeffberk/mane
jefberk@freenet.columbus.oh.us
Nothing does so much for the insides of a man than the outsides of a
horse.

Stanley Friesen (sarima@ix.netcom.com) wrote:
: James Maynard  wrote:
: >	I've just stumbled onto this group & have read all entries (as of 
: >8/25) concerning this post, but not one of them mentioned iridium. While 
: >very rare on Earth, iridium is found quite commonly in asteroids;  ...
: 
: Yes, quite true, and this is indeed one more piece of evidence that
: one or more imapcts occurred.
	Stan, awhile ago we talked about a combination of events 
that may have occurred at about the K-T boundary.  The title of 
the posts was "The K-T 1-2?".  It was either about a second impact
crater that had been identified or re-dated (perhaps the Manson,
Iowa site) closer to the K-T boundary, which would have made it 
the "softening" blow;  OR a series of flood basalts that were quite
close to, but not on, the K-T boundary that would have pushed the
dinos over the edge.  I can't find the reference I had to this.  Do 
you have a recollection of this?
===============================================
|  James G. Acker                             |
|  REPLY TO:   jgacker@neptune.gsfc.nasa.gov  |
===============================================
All comments are the personal opinion of the writer
and do not constitute policy and/or opinion of government
or corporate entities.

In article <500jfu$e47@pangea.Stanford.EDU>,
Bruce Salem  wrote:
>	The moon is receeding from the earth at an observed rate. I don't
>recall how much, but this would seem to result from tides raised by it
>slowing down the earth's rotation and the moon being moved to higher orbit
>as the system conserves angular momentum. Heat would be a byproduct.
About 1.5 cm a year from lunar-laser ranging studies.
>	This implies that at sometime in the distant past, billions
>of years ago, that the earth rotated faster and that the moon was nearer.
>In that distant epoch there would have been solar eclipses where a moon
>with a much bigger appearent size that the sun would have blotted out the
>sun on earth for hours instead of minutes. Lunar and solar eclipses would
>have been more frequent. Depending on how far away the moon actually was,
>prehaps with every lunation.
An article in the science news about weeks ago estimated 481 18.2 hour days
in the early paleozoic from counting daily and yearly growth rings,
I forgot in either shells or sedimentation.
(I believe the 18.2 hour is too slow because the product of those two numbers gives
the same number of hours as the current year.  A year would have been a little
shorter back then due to solar tidal friction.)

In article <4vsemp$jkn@post.gsfc.nasa.gov>,
James G. Acker  wrote:
>         Personal note:  why do solar eclipses keep missing ME?!
> 
>  1970 -- Totality on East Coast;
>  College years (1977-1981):  Totality along US/Canadian northern border
>  1984 or 1985: (the "I'm an idiot" eclipse).  Totality/annularity in Atlanta
Well you got plenty of eclipses in your country!!!  In my country we
have:
1954 -- totality in southern Sweden
2126 -- totality in middle Sweden
Note that we have NO total solar eclipses at all from 1955 to 2125!
To be fair, we do have two annular eclipses during this time interval,
one on 2039 and another in 2048.  Then I'll be 89 and 98 years old....
Also, earlier generations did get to see many more total solar
eclipses here: we had total solar eclipses in 1851, 1896, 1914, 1927,
1945 and 1954.  I was 4 years old during the 1954 eclipse, and saw it
as partial (some 95% of the Sun covered by the Moon).  I remember
viewing the Sun through a dark glass and seeing the crescent-shaped
part of the solar disk that was not hidden.  I believed I saw the
crescent moon of course, and I got puzzled that the Moon was seen
during the day....
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Schlyter,  Swedish Amateur Astronomer's Society (SAAF)
Grev Turegatan 40,  S-114 38 Stockholm,  SWEDEN
e-mail:  pausch@saaf.se        psr@home.ausys.se

Chris Behnsen (wn181@news.freenet.victoria.bc.ca) wrote:: Michael Agney (magney@winnie) wrote:
: : Jered Moses (kidkibtz@expert.cc.purdue.edu) wrote:
: : That is to say, mathematics doesn't _necessarily_ have anything to do with
: : reality.  It just so happens that reality is often more imaginative than
: : mathematicians.  (Sorry about the teleology.)
: Not at all true.  What about non-linear mathematics?  They involve a 
: certain amount of imagination, and hardly EVER have any real "rules"?
: Just a question to satisfy my undying need to know.:)
From what I've seen, a lot of the more recent interest in non-linear
mathematics is actually _based_ on observations that reality often can't
be adequately represented by linear approximations.  So, this is a case of
reality suggesting mathematics, IMHO.
--
Michael Agney

In article <4vq6m4$sdi@kruuna.helsinki.fi>,
Osmo Ronkanen  wrote:
> In Helsinki there was a total eclipse in 1990, the next is in 2126.
> I do not know of the previous one, but it was certainly before 1945.
In Stockholm the last total solar eclipse was in 1715, and there won't
be another one until some time around 2300.
Another opposite extreme: the total solar eclipse of June 1973 was
visible in, among other places, Mauritania in west Africa.  Half a
year later there was an annular eclipse where the path of annulatiry
also crossed Mauritaina, and the central lines of the two eclipses
actually crossed each other somewhere in west Africa.  No, these were
not two total eclipses (two total eclipses never happens only 1/2
year apart, but two annular-total eclipses can happen 1/2 year
apart), nevertheless one could here see two central solar eclipses
only 1/2 year apart -- a quite rare situation.
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------
Paul Schlyter,  Swedish Amateur Astronomer's Society (SAAF)
Grev Turegatan 40,  S-114 38 Stockholm,  SWEDEN
e-mail:  pausch@saaf.se        psr@home.ausys.se

Part-time position (10-15 hours a week_ in the Oil and Gas Section, 
Illinois State Geological Survey to compile and enter geological data 
into a database; digitize, edit and print geological maps on request. 
Requires knowledge of spreadsheet and database, as well as general 
strataigraphic relationships.  Knowledge of Illinois stratigrapher and 
wireline logs interpretation is a plus.  $6.00-$6.50 per hour.
Qualifications:  Freshman or sophomore standing with coursework in the 
physical sciences.  Prefer junior or senior in geology.
For an application contact Human Resources Office, 129 Natural Resources 
Bldg., 615 E. Peabody Drive, Champaign, IL.  
Phone:  217/244/2401
FAX:    217;/244/7004
EMAIL:  walston@geoserv.isgs.uiuc.edu

                           AVAILABLE IMMEDIATELY
A part-time position (10-15 hours a week) in the Oil and Gas Section to 
compile and enter geologic data; digitize, edit, and print geologic maps 
on request.
Requires familiarity with spreadsheets, databases, and general 
stratigraphic relationships.  Knowledge of Illinois stratigraphy and 
wireline log interpretation a plus.
Qualitications:  Freshman or sophomore standing with course work in 
physical sciences.  Prefer junior or senior in geology.
Salary:  $6.00-$6.50
For an application contact:  Human Resource Office, 129 Natural Resources 
Bldg., 615 E. Peabody Drive, Champaign, IL  
Phone:  217/244-2401
FAX:    217/244-7004
EMAIL:  walston@geoserv.isgs.uiuc.edu