Subject: Re: Water Fuel Cells
From: Arnt Karlsen
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 23:53:24 +0100
References:
1 , 2 , 3 , 4
..accept my apology for possible obsolete post,
Around Tue, 15 Oct 1996,
Harry H Conover wrote:
>
> OGDENS (OGDENS@fox.nstn.ca) wrote:
> : In article , alanterdc@cix.compulink.co.uk says...
[snip]
> :
> : Please correct me if I'm wrong. I want it to be this simple way, but if H2 doesn't burn this cleanly, I want
> : to know.
[snip]
>
> Conventional IC engines produce nitrogen compounds as well, but there
> isn't nearly as much water produced by their combustion process, so
> most of these products become vented in the exhaust.
[snip]
..conv. IC engines burn hydrocarbons, main tailpipe products are N2
(from air), CO2 and H2O, weight of each of the
last two products typically, ah, *match* fuel consumed... ;-)
[snip]
> However, even
> the small amount of
[snip]
..carbon...
[snip]
> acid produced is responsible for much of the
> engine wear, and almost all of the exhaust system corrosion.
>
..cold starts eat more (engine) metal...
> Steam engines solve the water corrosion problem through the application
> of exotic corrosion resistant metals, or coat all the surfaces with
> a constant flow of oil.
[snip]
..steamers use inhibitors, more cost effective... ;-)
> Harry C.
>
--
..KR f Arnt
..URL:disclaimer...
Subject: Re: Water Fuel Cells
From: Arnt Karlsen
Date: Fri, 15 Nov 1996 23:55:22 +0100
References:
1
..accept my apology for posting late,
around Sat, 05 Oct 1996,
Frederick Allen wrote:
>
> Can anyone help me with some research into water fuel cells? I heard that
> someone called Stan Myer (or Mayer?) was working on a top secret device
> with NASA. I am also trying to track down an individual, possibly English,
> who has supposedly constructed a device that can cut through metal using a
> high-temp hydrogen flame, using water as the fuel.
.._both_ hydrogen and ( high pressure ) water will cut metals,
industrial
use I'm aware of use electric and acetylene torches, and high pressure
water.
--
..KR f Arnt
..URL:disclaimer...
Subject: Re: Efficient Hydrogen Engine
From: Mick Cayton
Date: Sat, 16 Nov 1996 18:10:39 -0800
DeCatalyst wrote:
>
> Antoni and Marjorie Paleshi wrote:
> >
> > Greetings,
> >
> > I am searching for some information on the principles of hydrogen prduction
> > through electrolysis of H20. I'm attempting to reasearch and develop a
> > theoretical hybrid hydrogen/electrical car. By impliments a tight loop
> > vaccum combustion system, much like a standard gasoline engine, but using
> > electrolysis to produce hydrogen and oxygen as the fuel. This has probably
> > been done before, but I find the prosepect very interesting. My only
> > problem is that I have limit research tools and am pressed for time. Any
> > information concering the efficiency and logic of this idea is much
> > appreciated.
> >
> > Thank you,
> >
> > Antoni P.
>
> Perhaps my reply to Scott Mensch "H2 Engine Conversion", may be of some
> assistance re information source.
********************
Hi,
I think the hybrid system including a hydrogen fuelled i.c./electric
motor hybrid is not the most efficient approach to the ULEV concept.
Although several of the large manufacturers (namely BMW) carried out
some research on hydrogen burning ICs, the pre-ignition problems have
not been totally cured, and the low energy density and storage problems
(compared to gasoline) have not been suitably addressed for mass market.
One approach is the solid polymer electrolyte fuel cell SPFC. The fuel
cell operates on a thermodynamically reversible cycle; feed it hydrogen
and oxygen and power will be produced, or apply power and water and
hydrogen and oxygen will be the end result. This does not evade the fuel
storage issue but SPFCs do operate at high efficiencies - 60% HHV is
feasible - and the output is as near to emmission free as makes no
difference.
Much research is taking place in this direction (including my own) and
the technology is approaching the stage where costs are dropping
sufficiently to make volume production not too distant.
Bye.
Mick Cayton,
SPFC R&D;,
Loughborough University,
UK.
