Newsgroup sci.geo.satellite-nav 26238

Directory

Subject: Re: What AUTOMATIC track mode mean -- From: hf@cfn.ist.utl.pt (Horacio Fernandes)
Subject: Re: Any source for coordinates in Italy? -- From: Tore Bergstr=?iso-8859-2?Q?=F6m ?=
Subject: Re: Any source for coordinates in Italy? -- From: rfguba@ma.ultranet.com (Bob Guba)
Subject: Re: Transit (NNSS) Status -- From: Frank Burgum
Subject: Re: Transit NNSS Status -- From: Frank Burgum
Subject: Solar Azimut and Elevation -- From: fabarca@prokofiev.ugr.es (Francisco Abarca)
Subject: Re: Lower Prices on Magellan 2000 -- From: pharmet@aol.com
Subject: Re: Ascertaining WPT's from a recorded track? -- From: Mike James
Subject: Re: Trimble 26dB gain active antenna -- From: teekay@netidea.com
Subject: Re: NMEA media access control -- From: DTC21
Subject: Re: sextants etc. -- From: am152@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Donald Blakley)
Subject: Re: GPS w/o SA -- From: dickw@iastate.edu (Richard Wallingford)
Subject: Re: NMEA media access control -- From: dave@ormtec.demon.co.uk (Dave White)
Subject: A ftp site for NACGIS Version 2.0 (test version)! -- From: nac@zap.io.org (The International NAC Society)
Subject: Satallite photos -- From: jadario@mit.edu (Joe Adario)
Subject: Re: cheap time standard -- From: jimbell@pacifier.com (jimbell)
Subject: Looking for FAQ and product comparisons -- From: gbynum@crossco.com
Subject: Re: Garmin Web Site -- From: albert@data.net (Albert Nurick)
Subject: Reminder - GPS in Forestry Workshop '96 -- From: ernst-s@vcr.feric.ca (Ernst Stjernberg)
Subject: Re: Any source for coordinates in Italy? -- From: Mike Rabideau
Subject: Re: sextants etc. -- From: dmulcar@ibm.net (Donald M. Mulcare)
Subject: Proximity Waypoints??? (Garmin 90) -- From: Christian Gobbe
Subject: Re: Garmin 45 battery power -- From: Frank Dinger
Subject: Re: Single-receiver Accuracy -- From: Sam Wormley
Subject: Re: GPS+notebook+autopilot -- From: bennett@erich.triumf.ca (P.Bennett)
Subject: Re: GPS useless for mountaineering -- From: Brett_Conaway@brown.edu
Subject: Re: GPS on Swissair -- From: cfisher@interaccess.com (Charlie Fisher)
Subject: Re: DGPS performance from a GPS 2000 -- From: bennett@erich.triumf.ca (P.Bennett)
Subject: Re: Garmin Web Site -- From: Patrick Chung
Subject: Re: Bubble sextant.... -- From: NIKOLAUS FOELLMER
Subject: Re: Garmin GPS-II...Mine just arrived! -- From: wendtm@fn3.freenet.tlh.fl.us (Mark Wendt)
Subject: Re: Garmin's phone number? -- From: randy@agames.com (Randy Davis)
Subject: Re: Single-receiver Accuracy -- From: WhiteR@CRPL.Cedar-Rapids.lib.IA.US (Robert S. White)
Subject: Re: Looking for FAQ and product comparisons -- From: slr@crl.com (S. Rennacker)
Subject: Re: Looking for FAQ and product comparisons -- From: slr@crl.com (S. Rennacker)
Subject: Re: WGS-84 -- From: geo@geo-konzept.de (Thomas Muhr)
Subject: Re: Need Trimble protocol info -- From: Paul Kronfield
Subject: Re: sextants etc. -- From: Tony Sprent
Subject: Re: Rockwell protocol -- From: jvaline@isle.net (Jeff Valine)
Subject: Re: What AUTOMATIC track mode mean -- From: caveman@castles.com (Mikey)

Articles

Subject: Re: What AUTOMATIC track mode mean
From: hf@cfn.ist.utl.pt (Horacio Fernandes)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 96 12:44:49 GMT
In article <562c5l$39k@harpo.cs.ubc.ca>, davem@cs.ubc.ca (Dave Martindale) wrote:
>Just change the map scale.  If all you want to do is look at the saved
>track, set the map display to the smallest scale that you are going to
>want to use when looking at it.  If you are saving data points for later
>analysis, set the map scale to the smallest scale you might want to use
>when looking at the map later.  Or just change the track log mode to
>timed sampling.
>
>        Dave
Thanks for the advice. But I tried to do that and seems that the aquisition 
rate is the same (I'm using an external digital map to plot data)
Best regards
Horacio
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Subject: Re: Any source for coordinates in Italy?
From: Tore Bergstr=?iso-8859-2?Q?=F6m ?=
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 07:44:22 -0800
Found 
    http://164.214.2.53/gns/html/index.html
to be a good source for coordinates.
take care when driving(in Italy)
TB
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Subject: Re: Any source for coordinates in Italy?
From: rfguba@ma.ultranet.com (Bob Guba)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:00:18 GMT
"C. R. Tucker"  wrote:
>I'm planning to be driving in Italy for a couple of weeks. Anyone know
>of a source for GPS data for there?
>Thanks.
The DMA has lat/lon for most locations in the world on their
GEOnet names server
http://164.214.2.53/gns/html/index.html
Bob Guba			"When the weather gets worse,
Amateur Radio: W1QMN	 	 the company gets better." 
19T 296336 4706643 WGS84
E-Mail: rfguba@ma.ultranet.com
Home Page: http://www.ultranet.com/~rfguba/
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Subject: Re: Transit (NNSS) Status
From: Frank Burgum
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:02:41 GMT
Tony Hedge wrote:
> 
> Anyone now the current and planned status of the old Transit
> constellation - ie is it still running, how long will it be
> maintained?
> 
> Tony Hedge
> 100407.1114@compuserve.com
This is supposed to be turned off on Dec 31, 1996.
The similar Russian system, Tsicada, is still operating AFAIK.
-- 
+--------------------------------------------+-------------------------+| Frank Burgum, Navigation & Sensors Section | tel: +44 1703 316440    |
| Philips Semiconductors Systems Laboratory  | fax: +44 1703 316304    |
| Southampton, U.K                           | SERI: burgum@ukpsshp1   |
| Email: Frank.Burgum@soton.sc.philips.com   |                         |
+--------------------------------------------+-------------------------+
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Subject: Re: Transit NNSS Status
From: Frank Burgum
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 13:56:33 GMT
David Harvey wrote:
> 
> In article <55sh5g$kum@hil-news-svc-2.compuserve.com>,
> 100407.1114@compuserve.com (Tony Hedge) wrote:
> 
> >Anyone now current and planned status of the old Transit constellation
> >- are the satellites still going/any planned switch-off date?
> >
> >Tony Hedge, Benthic Sciences, UK
> >100407.1114@compuserve.com
> >
> 
> The NNSS (Navy Navigation Satellite System) is operating with a reduced
> number of satellites and I've been told that you can wait 8 hours for a
> position fix. There are rumours that the NNSS service will end this year.
> 
> I would also like to know what will happen.
> 
> David Harvey
> harvey@gol.com
> 
> 
At the international NAV'96 conference in London last week, we were informed
that the Transit system will be turned off on Dec 31st 1996, "having been
superseded by GPS".  An almost identical Russian system, Tsicada, is still
operating.
-- 
+--------------------------------------------+-------------------------+
| Frank Burgum, Navigation & Sensors Section | tel: +44 1703 316440    |
| Philips Semiconductors Systems Laboratory  | fax: +44 1703 316304    |
| Southampton, U.K                           | SERI: burgum@ukpsshp1   |
| Email: Frank.Burgum@soton.sc.philips.com   |                         |
+--------------------------------------------+-------------------------+
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Subject: Solar Azimut and Elevation
From: fabarca@prokofiev.ugr.es (Francisco Abarca)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 08:58:24 GMT
Hi everyone,
        I need some parameters to proccess a topographic correction. This
parameters can be read from the header of the image, but I have a copy
of it and it have no header. So, I ask if someone know about a program
to calculate solar azimut and solar elevation from the latitude, altitude
and date and hour when the image was taken.
        Many thanks in advance.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Francisco Abarca
Faculty of Science
University of Granada
fabarca@carpanta.ugr.es
http://carpanta.ugr.es/~fabarca
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Subject: Re: Lower Prices on Magellan 2000
From: pharmet@aol.com
Date: 12 Nov 1996 14:40:06 GMT
I just bougt a Magellan 2000 for 149.95 from a "K's Merchandise" (similar
to Service Merchandise), and I don't think the unit was mis-labelled.
Pat
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Subject: Re: Ascertaining WPT's from a recorded track?
From: Mike James
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:35:39 GMT
Don Bartlett wrote:
> 
> Only being familiar with my own Garmin 75, I am wondering
> if any of the newer units are able to "read" the coordinates
> of points on a recorded track.
> 
> I would like to record a track while following a bush road in
> the vehicle and later, record the coordinates of the turns in
> the road so that it could be manually plotted to a topo map.
On my 45XL, you activate the 'tracback' feature. Your recorded track is 
converted into a route, comprising a series of waypoints called T001 ...
Tnnn
which can then be used either as a route home or used as your 'corner'
positions - they are fairly intelligently chosen where your course was
recorded as having changed. 
768 log points -> about 30 Tnn waypoints
> 
> In reading of persons using the "blob" method of getting the
> best accuracy at a stationary position, after permitting the
> track to record for some time, it was suggested that the "+"
> on the plot screen could be scrolled to the apparent center of
> the blob and the coordinates then noted. (The Garmin 75 does
> not permit this and I must wait until the blob centers itself
> over my center screen "+" before taking a fix.)
> 
> Do the Garmin 38, 45's and II allow this? What about the Eagles?
> 
> --
> Don M. Bartlett: bartlett@freenet.carleton.ca or dbartlett@synapse.net
>    see:  http://www.ncf.carleton.ca/~ae374/gpsutm  for "article"
-- 
Mike James  mailto:Mike.James@soton.sc.philips.com
Tel. +44 (0)1703 316 319   Fax. +44 (0)1703 316 304
home: http://www.hamble.demon.co.uk
home: mailto:mike@hamble.demon.co.uk
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Subject: Re: Trimble 26dB gain active antenna
From: teekay@netidea.com
Date: 12 Nov 1996 15:20:42 GMT
teekay@netidea.com wrote:
>...The specs for this antenna say that a ground plane is needed...
Sorry, this was an error! I meant to point out that the specs say a
ground plane is NOT needed!
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Subject: Re: NMEA media access control
From: DTC21
Date: 12 Nov 1996 16:15:11 GMT
Could you give me more info about these multiplexers?
Where can I get more information?
Thanks in advance,
Mauricio
rortt@mgs.dnr.md.gov (Richard A. Ortt, Jr.) wrote:
>NMEA specifically is designed so that there can only be one "talker" on the
>line.  There are devices out there that multiplex many talkers and put out there
>signals on one NMEA line.  This line can then be fed into all of your devices.
>
>
>
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Subject: Re: sextants etc.
From: am152@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Donald Blakley)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 16:04:49 GMT
curtis cameron (curtis_cameron@hp.com) writes:
> In earlier posts, people here had educated me on the way latitude is
> measured on an ellipsoid model of the earth.  What I learned is that
> the normal to the surface indicates latitude.  This makes sense, 
> because the captain on a ship at sea would have this as a
> reference.  The normal can be found by bisecting the horizon-to-
> horizon angle in all directions.
> 
> But what if I'm Meriwether Lewis, with Rocky Mountains all around me?
> If I can't see the horizon, how do I find the normal?  The phrase
> "bubble sextant" that I've seen here makes me think that maybe you
> could use a bubble, or a plumb bob, to find the gravity direction.
> 
> But it doesn't seem obvious to me that a plumb bob would point
> the same direction as the normal.  On a sphere, of course it would,
> but on an ellipsoid, does it?  It seems to me that it might point at
> the center of the ellipsoid, or somewhere between that direction and
> the normal.
> 
> And what about variations in gravity caused by nearby masses like 
> mountains?  How much error would this cause?
The surveyors in the crowd may be the best ones to answer this but from a
navigator's point of view here are some thoughts. You are quite right
there is a geocentric and a geographic centre of the earth and they are
not the same. However for the practical purposes of a navigator all is
considered spherical. For example the stars are assumed to be all
equidistant from the earth on the celestial sphere, as is the sun. The
moon because of its proximity is a special case. 
With a bubble sextant, certainly in a faster moving vehicle such as an
aircraft coriolis (earth's rotational effect) on the bubble can be
calculated and compensted for as is atmpspheric refraction etc. But no
concern is shown by the navigator for errors which may be  introduced by the
fact the earth is an oblate spheroid (slightly pear shaped). They for
practical purposes are ignored. The surveyor has a slightly different
problem and uses a transit I believe rather than a sextant, but I don't
know how or if they correct for discrepency in determining the vertical. I
believe they did however take numerous sights over a period to determine a
datum which may have helped solve the problem. 
Cheers
DB
--
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Subject: Re: GPS w/o SA
From: dickw@iastate.edu (Richard Wallingford)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 17:23:49 GMT
In article ,
Mark Crispin   wrote:
>On Mon, 11 Nov 1996, Gene Fornario wrote:
>> From what I read in "GPS Made Easy"...two signals are sent from each
>> satellite, PPS and SPS with SA.  So if I understand this correctly, a
>> PPS capable receiver can decrypt and use PPS.  Does this mean the unit
>> ignores the SPS + SA signal?
>
>A PPS-capable receiver, *when loaded with cryptokeys and algorithms*, is
>not affected by SA; it knows how to cancel SA.  
This is technically incorrect.   It *removes* SA, not cancels it.
People typically refer to *cancellation* of SA along with other errors
when describing error cancelling techniques such as "differential GPS".   
-- 
Dick
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Subject: Re: NMEA media access control
From: dave@ormtec.demon.co.uk (Dave White)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 16:04:38 +0000
In article: <56793k$hth@rjo02.embratel.net.br>  DTC21 
 writes:
> Path: 
ormtec.demon.co.uk!news.demon.co.uk!dispatch.news.demon.net!demon!btnet!
newsfeed.internetmci.com!howland.erols.net!news-peer.gsl.net!news.gsl.ne
t!hammer.uoregon.edu!news.uoregon.edu!news.unisys.com.br!news.embratel.n
et.br!usenet
> From: DTC21 
> Newsgroups: sci.geo.satellite-nav
> Subject: NMEA media access control
> Date: 11 Nov 1996 13:18:44 GMT
> Organization: Embratel
> Lines: 14
> Message-ID: <56793k$hth@rjo02.embratel.net.br>
> NNTP-Posting-Host: 200.255.255.98
> Mime-Version: 1.0
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> X-Mailer: Mozilla 1.2N (Windows; I; 16bit)
> 
> Hi,
> 
> I would like to ask if NMEA uses any media access protocol?
> For instance, if there are 2 NMEA talkers sharing the same Tx line, 
will one wait the other
> and avoid collisions like in Ethernet LAN's (CSMA/CD protocol) ?
> Thanks in advance,
> 
> Mauricio
No it does not share lines. 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
-- 
Dave White                                     Ormston Technology Ltd
Email:dave@ormtec.demon.co.uk                    Tel: +44 1482 804104
http://www.ormtec.demon.co.uk                    Fax: +44 1482 803955
Dassault Sercel UK agent and maker of much telemetry and data logging
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Subject: A ftp site for NACGIS Version 2.0 (test version)!
From: nac@zap.io.org (The International NAC Society)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 12:53:34 -0500
Dear Readers:
The NACGIS Version 2.0 test version is ready for everybody to test.  You
can download it from the Internet at address:
	ftp://empires.stanford.edu/pub/win95/utils/nacgis2.exe
If you have problems, we can also email it to you. If you like, you can
also put it into your anonymous ftp site and post it on the net or send
email to us. 
Have fun on the software!
Xinhang Shen
http://www.io.org/~nac/
Dear Readers:
Last week, we posted the following ads which included a wrong web address.
The correct address is http://www.io.org/~nac/
Many people ask what the system requirements of the software are.  Since 
we use dynamic linking libraries all through the code, the software 
requires little RAM and hard disk space. If the computer has: 
	Windows 95 or Windows NT
	Larger than 4 MB RAM
	Larger than 4 MB Hard disk space
the software will work properly on small map files (<1 MB).
Now the test version of the software is ready for everybody to test all
functions of the software.  If you want it, I can email you the software
(2.4 MB)free of charge. If you want to get 3.5" floppy disk, please 
include US$5 shipping and handling fee.ÿï Once you have tested the 
software, please send us your comments and suggestions and report all the 
problems. You cam also post them on the net.
By the way, the software can import text files of lists of longitude/latitude
or UTM or other coordinates and character strings with coordinates and angles.
If you have these kinds of maps and would like to sell them, please drop an
email to our account and we will include them on our web.  If you have map
converters which can extract map entities from other GIS file formats and 
create node lists and character string lists, we will be happy to 
list them on our web too.
Have fun to play on NACGIS Version 2.0.
Xinhang Shen
NAC Geographic Products Inc.
===============================================================================
|                                                                             |
|       Great News!                                                           |
|                                                                             |
|       You can buy a US$999 GIS with only US$39 before Nov. 20, 1996!        |
|                                                                             |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------------------|
|  Contents                                                                   |
|                                                                             |
|  Introduction                                                               |
|  Major features                                                             |
|  Discount information                                                       |
|  Order information                                                          |
===============================================================================
Introduction
   NAC Geographic Products Inc. has developed a geographic information system 
   called NACGIS Version 2.0 for Windows 95 and Windows NT, which has 
   implemented the great invention: the Natural Area Coding System.  Based on 
   the Natural Area Coding System, NACGIS has introduced a ten-character 
   Universal Geographic Identity for every geographic object in the world.  No 
   matter what size it is.  Every geographic object in the world from a 
   continent to a parking meter can be statistically uniquely identified by its
   Universal Geographic Identity (UGID).
Major features:
   1. Automatic assignment of UGID's to all geographic objects.
   2. Automatic links between a graphic object in the map file and its 
      associated document in the document database.  You can use both text 
      searching and mouse clicking on the graphic object to retrieve the 
      document for reading and editing.
   3  Supports transparency which allows you draw transparent graphic objects 
      with all pictures underneath shown in a mixed color.
   4. Graphics editor's features:
      a) Drawing tools:
         NACGIS Version 2.0 procides two sets of drawing tools: 
          i)  Mouse direct drafting on the screen with your specified default
              line color, line type, line thickness, brush color, brush 
              pattern, font type, font size, font color, layer number, etc. 
         ii)  Graphic object set-up dialog boxes to create accurate pictures.  
              The dialog boxs allow you input exact coordinates for polyline 
              nodes and polygon vertices and layer number, text escapement 
              angle, layer number, specify whether it is a polyline or smooth 
              curve and a polygon or an area, whether it is transparent, and 
              set up pen, brush and font parameters.  You can insert or delete 
              nodes or vertices at any location of a polyline or a polygon.  
              A polyline, polygon, simple picture or a group picture can be 
              converted to each other by simply clicking a botton on the dialog
              boxes.   
         NACGIS Version 2.0 can draw polylines, curves, polygons, areas, simple
         pictures (ractangle, circle, ellipse, regular polygons, stars, etc.), 
         text objects, bitmap objects and group pictures (from an art gallery 
         database).
      b) Manipulation tools:
         NACGIS Version 2.0 provides the following graphic objects manipulation
         tools:
         i)  Mouse and arrow keys direct draging and resizing
        ii)  Manipulation dialog box which allows you move an graphic object or
             a group of graphic objects a specified distance or to a specified
             location, exactly stretch it in x- and/or y-directions, rotate it 
             a specified angle arround a specified pivot, and mirror it in x- 
             and/or y-directions with a specified symetric center.
       iii)  Alignment dialog box which allows you align a group of graphic
             objects to the left, center, right, top, middle, bottom.
        iv)  Group objects tool which allows you to create group pictures (only
             one set of a group picture's data will be stored in the memory 
             but can be shown in as many places as you want, which will greatly
             simplify your drawing and save memory). Once the group picture is
             created, you can also add it to the art gallery database of the
             software for later use. 
         v)  Delete, Erase All, Undo, Cut, Copy and Paste tools
        vi)  Grid generator which can automatically generate the appropriate 
             level of the NAC grids.
   5. Map viewing tools
      NACGIS Version 2.0 provides the following map viewing tools:
         i)  Theme layers dialog box allows you select the visible layers for 
             the current map.  It can store 120 different theme layers.
        ii)  Zoom In and Zoom Out tools allows you zoom in as many time as you 
             want and zoom back to the origanal picture.
       iii)  Split panes of a winow, multiple windows of a document and 
             multiple windows of multiple documents.  NACGIS Version 2.0 allows
             you to view different parts of a map in different panes or 
             windows, view different scales in different panes, and
             compare different maps in different windows.
        iv)  Display of the cursor's coordinates in Longitude/Latitude, UTM and
             NAC simultaneously on the status bar of the frame window.
         v)  Coordinate systems
             NACGIS Version 2.0 supports three types of coordinate systems: 
             Longitude/Latitude system, UTM system and user-defined system.  
             You can import a map file in one coordinate system and export it 
             in another system (Longitude/Latitude <=> UTM).
        vi)  Window setting
             You can set the scroll window size, window background color, the 
             coordinates of the top left corner of the window and suitable 
             scale to create the best view for the map. 
   6. Document editor's features
      NACGIS Version 2.0 also provides a powerful document editor which allows 
      you to read and edit the attached document of a graphic object.  The 
      attached document is named by the UGID of a geographic object, which can 
      cantain text contents with all kinds of fonts, font styles, sizes and 
      colors, bitmaps, and all other objects created by OLE servers such as 
      Excel Charts and Worksheets.
   7. Help file
      NACGIS Version 2.0 provides a powerful help system which has the 
      following features:
         i)  Context help
             Whenever you need help for a dialog or a menu command, you can get
             the help topic immediately by pressing F1.  You can also press the
             button with an arrow and a question mark on the toolbar and the 
             move the cursor to the item about which you need help and
             click the left button of the mouse to get the help topic.
        ii)  Tooltips
             NACGIS Version 2.0 provides tooltips for all menu commands and 
             buttons.  When you move the cursor to a toolbar button, you will 
             see a yellow box with simple help text beside the cursor and a 
             bit more detail help text on the status bar of the frame window.  
       iii)  Topics, index and word search
             NACGIS Version 2.0 allows you to search help content by topics, 
             index and simply a word.
   8. Print, print preview and printer set-up
      NACGIS Version 2.0 provides you all the useful features for print, print 
      preview and printer set-up.  It allows you print black/while or color 
      map, and a large map into small pieces which can be connected together 
      to get a large map.  You can also print any part of a map if you set the 
      window size, the coordinates of the top left corner of the window and the
      appropriate scale of the map. 
   9. Support of file types
      NACGIS Version 2.0 mainly support its own map document files with the
      extension ".nac". However, it can import and export three types of text
      files: lists of polyline nodes coordinates, lists of polygon vertices
      coordinates and lists of text objects (text contents, insert point
      coordinates and escapement angle).  In the future vertions, we will add
      dxf files.  NAC Geographic Products Inc. also provides you various map
      documents at good prices.
Discount information
   NAC Geographic Products Inc. would like to offer you a special discounted
   price for the license of using NACGIS Version 2.0.  The standard price for
   the license for a single person using NACGIS Version 2.0 in one computer is
   US$999.  If you are using the software at home for non-business purposes,
   you can get 50% discount.  Once you have bought one license of the software,
   you will get a 80% discount for the license for a future version of the same
   sfotware. There is a special discount price now. If you buy the license 
   before November 20, 1996, you need to pay only US$39 + US$5 shipping fee 
   ( + 7% GST if in you are in Canada).  After then, the price will rise 
   everyday (about US$5.3 a day) until it reaches US$999.
Ordering information
   You can order the license by sending us the international money order
   (or a check if you are in Canada) or tell us the information of the VISA
   credit card (Credit card number, holder's name, expiration date and issuing
   bank name). The price is determined by the date you send out your order. 
   If you use credit card, you can also order it through Email, fax or phone.
   Please include the exact name, company, address, phone, fax, email for each
   licesee because the name and address will be embedded into the software.
   Our address is
                  NAC Geographic Products Inc.
                  509-50 Stephanie Street
                  Toronto, ON M5T 1B3
                  Canada
                  NAC: 8CHK  Q87P
                  Phone and fax: (416) 979 9306
                  Email:         nac@io.org
                  Web:           http://www.io.org
If you are doing land planning, NACGIS will be your great assistant!
If you are working on transportation, NACGIS will be your first assistant!
If you are managing natural resources, NACGIS will provide you the convenience!
If you are working on environment protection, NACGIS will be your power tool!
If you are doing marketing, NACGIS will give you extra hands, eyes and ears!
If you are managing real estate, NACGIS will let you get rid of tedious work!
If you like fishing, NACGIS will help you record the best fishing spots!
If you are a bird watcher, NACGIS will tell you where birds live and 
move!
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Subject: Satallite photos
From: jadario@mit.edu (Joe Adario)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:11:35 UNDEFINED
Hi,
We are looking for a high resoultion satallite image of coordinates N18 E30 in 
the Sudan.  Anyone have any suggestions for public domain photos web sites?
Please respond to jadario@mit.edu.  Many thanks.
Return to Top
Subject: Re: cheap time standard
From: jimbell@pacifier.com (jimbell)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 19:11:24 GMT
hprice@bektek.com (Harold Price) wrote:
>I want to kill two birds with one stone - get a cheap time source for a test, 
>and end up with a gps toy to play with.
>I'm building a piece of micro-processor based commercial equipment that logs 
>events by time.  It needs to be accurate with a drift of no more than a few 
>seconds a month, hopefully less. GPS is not required in that device.  To this 
>end, I'm counting the 60hz AC in the power supply and applying corrections to 
>the xtal-base real-time clock chip.  I need to average over time, as the power 
>company isn't WWV.  I need a source of time that isn't drifting so I can watch 
>my box and the power company and measure their drift and see what a good 
>averaging time is.  
Lots of tradeoffs, I think.  There are disadvantages with going GPS:  while the
cards are definitely getting cheap, you still have to buy an (amplified?)
antenna and you need to run the cable to the box.  Non-trivial and not
necessarily cheap.    You haven't given enough details to tell whether these are
real problems or not.
You might consider using a TCXO (temperature-compensated crystal oscillator) as
an alternative.  I have a few dozen 9.600 MHz DIP--type TCXO's, and they seem to
be  able to hold +/- 1 ppm over a wide range of temperatures, maybe 0 degrees to
60+ degrees C.    A more extensive frequency/temperature characterization of a
couple of units shows turnarounds in the 40-55 degree temperature range; I will
probably implement a "poor man's oven" by thermostatting the case of one such
TCXO.  It appears that keeping the case stable to 1 degree should produce a
frequency stability of better than 0.1 ppm, and probably better than 0.05 ppm.
The former value represents a second lost or gained in around 120 days, which
sounds substantially better than you need.  
Return to Top
Subject: Looking for FAQ and product comparisons
From: gbynum@crossco.com
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:01:05 -0600
I hope to receive a portable GPS this Christmas.
I want to know what I want!
The primary use will be on a sailboat used in predominately
coastal waters.  It will be used to supplement piloting and
magnetic compass bearings for position determination.
Are there FAQs to help me make my decision, or are there
product comparisons.  If on the Internet, please advise
sites where I should look.  If in a magazine, please pass
that on as well.
As I look, are there particular features which should be
given special consideration?
My news group access is very spotty; please reply via email.
THANKS
George W. Bynum
gbynum@crossco.com
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
This article was posted to Usenet via the Posting Service at Deja News:
http://www.dejanews.com/           [Search, Post, and Read Usenet News]
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Garmin Web Site
From: albert@data.net (Albert Nurick)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 15:20:20 -0600
In article , al@moyes.softnet.co.uk 
says...
> The latest date is now 12 November!!!
How fast is your connection?  Garmin has a software limitation of
2400 baud for those trying to access its web site.  There will be
a more expensive web site in the future that does not have this
limitation.  :-)
-- 
| Albert Nurick                     | "In case of doubt, decide in |
| albert@data.net                   |  favor of what is correct."  |
| http://www.data.net               |                              |
| http://www.data.net/albert        |                 - Karl Kraus |
Return to Top
Subject: Reminder - GPS in Forestry Workshop '96
From: ernst-s@vcr.feric.ca (Ernst Stjernberg)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 21:27:34 GMT
              **Reminder**
The "GPS in Forestry Workshop '96" will be held in Kelowna, British
Columbia, Canada, on November 25-27, 1996.
For information on the agenda, registration and a list of exhibitors,
see:
http://www.cariboo.bc.ca/schs/bcfcsn/bcfcsn.htm
Sponsored by 
Forest Engineering Research Institute of Canada (FERIC)
Contact
Ernst Stjernberg
ernst-s@vcr.feric.ca
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Any source for coordinates in Italy?
From: Mike Rabideau
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 17:11:52 -0800
C. R. Tucker wrote:
> 
> I'm planning to be driving in Italy for a couple of weeks. Anyone know
> of a source for GPS data for there?
> Thanks.
Try www.indo.com/distance/ .  It gives you the distance (as the crow 
flies) between two locations in the world and also the Lat/Lon.
Mike
-- 
__________________________________________________________________________
"La Longue Carabine"
Located @          |"This country, with its institutions, belongs to 
42 49.07'N         | the people who inhabit it. Whenever they shall grow
86 01.49' W        | weary of the existing government, they can exercise 
                   | their constitutional right of amending it, 
                   | or their revolutionary right to dismember or 
                   | overthrow it."
                                     -- Abraham Lincoln
Return to Top
Subject: Re: sextants etc.
From: dmulcar@ibm.net (Donald M. Mulcare)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 22:06:46 GMT
In <56a771$s9e@freenet-news.carleton.ca>, am152@FreeNet.Carleton.CA (Donald Blakley) writes:
>(with deletions)
>curtis cameron (curtis_cameron@hp.com) writes:
>> In earlier posts, people here had educated me on the way latitude is
>> measured on an ellipsoid model of the earth. 
>> But what if I'm Meriwether Lewis, with Rocky Mountains all around me?
>> If I can't see the horizon, how do I find the normal?  The phrase
>> "bubble sextant" that I've seen here makes me think that maybe you
>> could use a bubble, or a plumb bob, to find the gravity direction.
>> 
>> But it doesn't seem obvious to me that a plumb bob would point
>> the same direction as the normal.  On a sphere, of course it would,
>> but on an ellipsoid, does it?  It seems to me that it might point at
>> the center of the ellipsoid, or somewhere between that direction and
>> the normal.
>> 
>> And what about variations in gravity caused by nearby masses like 
>> mountains?  How much error would this cause?
>
>The surveyors in the crowd may be the best ones to answer this but from a
>navigator's point of view here are some thoughts. 
>The surveyor has a slightly different
>problem and uses a transit I believe rather than a sextant, but I don't
>know how or if they correct for discrepency in determining the vertical. I
>believe they did however take numerous sights over a period to determine a
>datum which may have helped solve the problem. 
>
>Cheers
>DB
>
I believe you are referring to the Deflection of the Vertical.  The 
deflection is the departure a plumb bob would take from the vertical 
defined by an ideal ellipsoidal Earth.  Deflections are used to relate
the orientation of a locally-leveled instructment to a spatial 
reference system.  It is used to correct zenith distances measurements
and to convert between astronomic and ellipsoidal azimuths.
You may want to examine the following resources:
http://www.ngs.noaa.gov/DEFLEC/deflec.html
         (the US NGS has a new deflection of the vertical model)
Geodetic Glossary of the US National Geodetic Survey
Basic Geodesy by J.R. Smith
Geodesy:The Concepts, by Vanicek and Krakiwsky
Physical Geodesy by Heiskanen and Moritz
The web site also has links to the software.  The glossary can be 
obtained from the NGS Info Center at 301.713.3242.  The other books 
are available from NAVTECH and elsewhere.  The first book is a good 
introduction to geodetic concepts without the math of the other two 
references.
|====================================================|
|== Donald M. Mulcare                   email:dmulcar@ibm.net ==|
|== NGS Advisor to Maryland            410.545.8963 (voice)  ==|
|====visit the ngs home page at http://www.ngs.noaa.gov =====|
|====================================================|
Return to Top
Subject: Proximity Waypoints??? (Garmin 90)
From: Christian Gobbe
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 21:45:12 +0000
I've been using GARDOWN8 to import/export waypoints, routes and track to
my Garmin 90. I see there is an option to upload/download 'proximity
waypoints', what are these? I find no reference in the receiver manual
and I understand the Garmin comms program also supports the transfer of
theese 'proximity waypoints'.
What is a 'proximity waypoint' (in the context of a Garmin receiver) ??
Help!
-- 
Christian Gobbe  
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Garmin 45 battery power
From: Frank Dinger
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 00:42:48 GMT
> I think satisfaction with rechargables (NiMH or NiCad) will vary a lot
> depending on the voltage requirements of your equipment.  With the
> rechargables carrying 1.25v at full charge compared to 1.5v for a fresh
> alkaline cell, your receiver may show "low bat" before the rechargable
> batteries get very discharged.
> I don't know Garmins low voltage cutout but 4AA (NiMH/NiCad) x 1.25v = 5v
> for a fresh set of batteries and 4AA (alkaline) x 1.5v = 6v for a fresh
> set.  Some equipment will think your rechargable batteries are low almost
> as soon as you put them in...
> Tyler Groo, EMT-B    |  Rager Emergency Services (RES)
===========
The voltage isn't all that important provided it's above the cutout level.
The advantage of using NiMH batteries is that they can deliver power 
to the unit at a voltage above the cut-out level longer than the 
alkaline 1.5V batteries.
My Garmin GPS40 works well below minimum voltage shown on bar indicator.
The  voltage can be checked by switching device in test mode.
For Garmin GPS 40/45 this can be done by keep pressing enter button  
before/while pressing switch-on button,then press enter again. To use 
receiver in normal way  after test,first switch-off and then switch 
on in usual way .
In test mode also the rx frequency and receiver temperature can be monitored
Frank Dinger , Inver by Tain , Ross-shire IV20 1RX - Scotland UK
e-mail :  frank.dinger@zetnet.co.uk   or   gm0csz.kn6wh@ukrs.org
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Single-receiver Accuracy
From: Sam Wormley
Date: 12 Nov 1996 22:52:31 GMT
Accuracy Statistics
                  Trimble's Acu-Lock on ScoutMaster
MIT Lincoln Laboratory's GLONASS group provided daily scatter plots of
GPS Position Estimates. See http://satnav.atc.ll.mit.edu/. It is obvious
that one's true position can be estimated using the average of positional
data collected over a long period... in this case 24 hours. I set out to
obtain an estimate of the repeatability of obtaining "true" position by
averaging over 24 hours.
If one obtains a sample of the population of computed positions and
computes the mean value for each sample, the sample mean values will be
normally distributed around the population mean, whether or not the
original population was normally distributed.
Using the Acu-Lock feature on Trimble's ScoutMaster GPS receiver the
following sample means (in meters) were collected. Each mean was derived
from 38000 samples automatically collected over a 24-hour period. 
The original data are reproduced here so that any reader may apply their
own statistical analysis to the data. My conclusion is that one has a
probability of .95 of being inside a circle of 5 meters (16.4 ft) radius 
when using the Acu-Lock feature on Trimble's ScoutMaster GPS over a 
24-hour period.
DATA                 -------Mean(meters)------ 
                     Easting   Northing  Alt   Date      Time (UT)
#,001,ACU.1.96.5.19 ,15,444912,T,4653491,00311,19-May-96,20:21:33,Acu-Lock,$
#,002,ACU.2.96.5.20 ,15,444917,T,4653488,00309,20-May-96,20:50:14,Acu-Lock,$
#,003,ACU.3.96.5.21 ,15,444915,T,4653492,00306,21-May-96,23:40:23,Acu-Lock,$
#,004,ACU.4.96.5.23 ,15,444909,T,4653493,00299,23-May-96,01:37:26,Acu-Lock,$
#,005,ACU.5.96.5.24 ,15,444919,T,4653490,00324,24-May-96,02:15:48,Acu-Lock,$
#,006,ACU.6.96.5.25 ,15,444917,T,4653493,00308,25-May-96,08:03:39,Acu-Lock,$
#,007,ACU.7.96.5.27 ,15,444915,T,4653493,00310,26-May-96,00:38:37,Acu-Lock,$
#,008,ACU.8.96.5.29 ,15,444916,T,4653491,00313,29-May-96,03:59:21,Acu-Lock,$
#,009,ACU.9.96.5.30 ,15,444917,T,4653489,00310,30-May-96,12:17:14,Acu-Lock,$
No of Sample Means      9
Range    Min            444909   4653488   299
         Max            444919   4653493   324
         Diff               10         5    25
Population Mean         444915.3 4653491.1 309.7 
SEM                     3.12     1.83      22.6
95% Conf Interval       6.12     3.59      44.4               
                     Scatter Plot 
            |---------- 10 meters ---------|
            .                  .     .           
                                                 |
                               .                 |
                                                 |
                      .           .              |
                                                 | 5 meters
                                           .     |
                                                 |
                                     .           |
                                                 |
                                     .           |      
"A measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions."
__________________________________________________
Sam Wormley - http://www.cnde.iastate.edu/gps.html
Return to Top
Subject: Re: GPS+notebook+autopilot
From: bennett@erich.triumf.ca (P.Bennett)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 15:20 PST
In article <5679h3$hth@rjo02.embratel.net.br>, DTC21  writes...
>Hi,
> 
>I would like to link my Garmin45 to my notebook which runs a nav program. It uses
>NMEA output from Garmin to figure out where I am. 	
>I also would like to have my nav program to control my autopilot (AUTOHELM 7000).
>The question is:
> 
>I only have 1 serial port. Garmin sends strings to the PC. The PC should send 
strings to the
>autopilot. Is there a cable to link the autopilot to a PC ? Is it possible 
using the same port? 
Yes - you only need the "receive" side of the serial port to receive data from
the GPS, and only the "send" side to send data to the pilot.
You will have to make a suitable cable yourself.
Peter Bennett VE7CEI                | Vessels shall be deemed to be in sight
Internet: bennett@triumf.ca         | of one another only when one can be
Packet: ve7cei@ve7kit.#vanc.bc.ca   | observed visually from the other
TRIUMF, Vancouver, B.C., Canada     |                          ColRegs 3(k)
GPS and NMEA info and programs: ftp://sundae.triumf.ca/pub/peter/index.html
or: ftp://ftp-i2.informatik.rwth-aachen.de/pub/arnd/GPS/peter/index.html
or: http://vancouver-webpages.com/peter/index.html
Return to Top
Subject: Re: GPS useless for mountaineering
From: Brett_Conaway@brown.edu
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 18:11:32 -0500
You all seem to assume that the maps (USGS or whatever) are the perfectly accurate.
After a few field seasons of mapping geologic structures on topo base maps, I've realized
they can be very! inaccurate.  Lets also realize that the earth is dynamic.  Some of those maps 
out there were produced in the 30's and haven't had a major revision since.  You can bet on 
quite a few things being different today, especially in highly eroding environments.  GPS is a 
great tool and can really get you out of a jam sometimes (I got lost in White Sands for about 
an hour with my 10 channel GPS in the car, pretty ironic.) If you are counting on a GPS for altitude 
measurments, don't expect to get better accuracy than a few hunderd meters, and anyone that tells 
you GPS accuracy is closer than +-100m minimun without a base station correction is selling one.
If anyone wants correction data to trully locate a point within a few 10's on meters I can get you
in touch with a basestation measurments by FTP.  E-mail me
Return to Top
Subject: Re: GPS on Swissair
From: cfisher@interaccess.com (Charlie Fisher)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 22:14:42 GMT
On Tue, 5 Nov 1996 09:29:40 +0000 (GMT),
n.w.nelson@education.leeds.ac.uk (nick nelson) wrote:
>James G. Wood wrote:
>> 
>> If you want to use your GPS on an aircraft a remote antenna that you can
>> stick to the window is probably essential. I suggest you mount it so that
>> you can sit in a way that prevents the cabin crew from seeing it. 
>
>Why?
>If it's not dangerous it shouldn't matter, and if it is you shouldn't
>be doing it. Or is it that the cabin staff just don't like passengers
>sticking stuff to aircraft windows?
>
>Nick.
Because it is illegal to operate any receiver in a commercial
aircraft. 
Charlie
Return to Top
Subject: Re: DGPS performance from a GPS 2000
From: bennett@erich.triumf.ca (P.Bennett)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 15:35 PST
In article <19961112014700.UAA13700@ladder01.news.aol.com>, pharmet@aol.com writes...
>Is there any way to get DGPS accuracy from a hand held GPS unit (like the
>GPS 2000)?  I'm new to GPS, and I would like to use it in my farming
>operation (mapping soil test locations, etc).  I know most agricultural
>applications use DGPS systems, but these are not easily portable.  Also,
>could someone explain how the DGPS system actually works (I know there are
>GPS satellites and transmitters around North America, but I don't know how
>the actual correction is done).
There is some discussion of DGPS in my GPS FAQ (available from the URLs below).
Most hand-held navigation receivers will accept DGPS correction data - but you
have to get that data from a separate receiver.  The US (and Canadian) Coast
Guard transmit DPGS corrections in the marine radiobeacon band (around 300KHz),
but DGPS receivers for this cost around US$500, last I looked.
There are commercial providers that broadcast the corrections on a subcarrier
on FM broadcast stations.  There is a subscription charge to use these
services.
Peter Bennett VE7CEI                | Vessels shall be deemed to be in sight
Internet: bennett@triumf.ca         | of one another only when one can be
Packet: ve7cei@ve7kit.#vanc.bc.ca   | observed visually from the other
TRIUMF, Vancouver, B.C., Canada     |                          ColRegs 3(k)
GPS and NMEA info and programs: ftp://sundae.triumf.ca/pub/peter/index.html
or: ftp://ftp-i2.informatik.rwth-aachen.de/pub/arnd/GPS/peter/index.html
or: http://vancouver-webpages.com/peter/index.html
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Garmin Web Site
From: Patrick Chung
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 14:23:08 -0600
On Mon, 11 Nov 1996, Al Moyes wrote:
> The latest date is now 12 November!!!
> 
> I reckon Christmas would be more accurate. (96 or 97)
> 
> Al Moyes                       al@moyes.softNET.co.uk
> 
>     "NEVER lost, just uncertain of my position"
> 
    After midnight tonight, it would be 13 November and so on. :)
  Pat Chung 
  CCCC   CCCC  C  C  C  C  CC  C  CCCC   # My last name "CHUNG" means #  TTYL
  C  C   C     CCCC  C  C  C C C  C CCC  #  clock in Cantonese as in  # 
  CCCC   C     C  C  C  C  C  CC  C  C   #      "Gey Deem Chung?"     #  JOY
  C   *  CCCC  C  C  CCCC  C   C  CCCC   # Winnipeg, Manitoba, Canada #  KING
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Bubble sextant....
From: NIKOLAUS FOELLMER
Date: 13 Nov 1996 00:26:49 GMT
1=BE=00=00=00=AB=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=FB	=00=00=15=00=16=00=16=00=16=00=16=
=00=17=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=18=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00Some thoughts on purchasing and usage of bubble sextants (BS). I own thr=
ee  US army air force BS, one Kollsman pericscope BS and  an odd bird - a U=
S navy ball recording sextant. Have them because of interest in navigation =
(air and marine - practical use and history). I use them to practice celest=
ail nav - stand on balcony or look out window at home to take sights at any=
 time of the day. Living in San Francisco I could go to the ocean beach but=
 thats inconvenient. Try to get a bs with a horizon view so you can actuall=
y use the horizon as a reference. Not all bs have that feature. I find that=
 the early USAAF bs is easy to use, simple in construction and maintenance =
Later models tend to be heavier, clumsier and  more complex. Bs are great f=
or practice but tend to have less accuracy in real boat navigation. To some=
 extent that is a matter of learning how to use them which is easy. Bs are =
certainly adequate for back up navigation, this being the age of GPS. Have =
a friend who has a british bs - find that they are awkward and clumsy to us=
e - but hey they work and are of historical value. Try to get a bs with a w=
orking buble. Probably the most common cause of bs failure is the fluid lea=
king out of the bubble chamber. Still trying to figure out the best fluid t=
o use - read some thing about xylene - don't know at what concentration. Ce=
lestaire in Kansas is a good source for bs parts, service, and manuals (the=
y sell copies of parts, service and usage manuals). They used to have five =
or six different bs in their catalogue but  I believe they are down to one =
in their current one with price is something like 500 dollars. I believe th=
ey are serviced and in working condition.  You can do better in marine flea=
 markets but these tend to be dirty, klunky with parts missing, but hey you=
 get 'em where you can find 'em.  I  have been lucky in finding them in sec=
ond hand marine stores. Navigation store sometimes carry them also.  Kollsm=
an bs are not suitable for handheld use because they were mounted in  a fix=
ture - not meant to be handheld but are also of historical value. Most bs h=
ave an averager device. These are probably more useful when flying where ce=
rtain oscillations occur. If anyone has any info on us navy ball recording =
sextants - how widely they were used and their history - I would appreciate=
 info.
Good luck and successful hunting for these pieces of navigation history!
Nikolaus Foellmer*-m whe=80=00=00=00=15	=00=00w=00=FB	=00=00s=00=FB	=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=03=00=
=00=14=03=01=00=14=02=80=00=00=00=9A	=00=00n=00=9C	=00=00n=00=E6	=00=00n=00=
=E8	=00=00n=00=FD	=00=00n=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=
=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=00=0C<=03=1E=00=00=00=00=00=00=00h=01=
=05=01=00=01=00=01=00=00=00=00=00orical value. Most bs have an averager dev=
ice. These are probably more useful when flying where certain oscillations =
o=01=00=07=00 Arial=00=00=00ne has any info on us navy ball recording sexta=
nts - how widely they were used and their history - I would apprecia
Return to Top
Subject: Re: Garmin GPS-II...Mine just arrived!
From: wendtm@fn3.freenet.tlh.fl.us (Mark Wendt)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 20:21:38 -0500
Christopher A. Glaves (cglaves@netcom.com) wrote:
: On Mon, 11 Nov 1996 08:10:36 -0500, Daniel Butler 
: >It seems that Garmin is shipping units across the pond 
: >before selling any in the states?  Has anyone in the US
: >been able to get a GPS-II yet?  If so, where did you get
: >it?  I've checked the stores online and the local marine
: >dealers and the story is either "real soon now" or late 
: >December.
: >
: On a recent trip aboard Delta I saw the Garmin GPS II for sale in the
: SkyMall Catalog.  It was on page 143 of the Holiday Gift 1996 Catalog.
: Here's the pertinent parts of the description:
: "... the compact GPS II features a state-of-the-art, two-way display
: for vertical or horizontal orientation.  A feature that's perfect for
: going from the dash of your vehicle to the palm of your hand.  Stores
: 250 locations and 20 reversible routes.  Moving map graphics and
: electronic compass.  Tough enough for any outdoor activity!
: Suggested retail $386.00
: Now $299.00
: Part# 975119
: 800.759.6255"
West Marine, and Outer Banks Marine Outfitters are both offering the 
Garmin GPS II for $250, while the 45XL is going for $279 and $289 
respectively. Who knows if either really has the unit in stock to ship
today though. Maybe they're just selling GPS II futures. :) *grin* 
  Too bad I have a degree in Surveying & Mapping, I could have stuck with
sales and made a commission off this quote...
      Mark Wendt "WHERES florida?"
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Subject: Re: Garmin's phone number?
From: randy@agames.com (Randy Davis)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 23:56:03 GMT
In article <8NOV199610232250@erich.triumf.ca>, P.Bennett (bennett@erich.triumf.ca) wrote:
|Garmin should (or so they claim) have their new web site
|(http://www.garmin.com") up in a couple of days. (when I looked yesterday, it
|said "wait til Nov. 9")
  It today (11/12/96) says wait till Nov. 12. :-)
  So, I sent the webmaster a letter that they might want to change it.
Seems the webmaster has their mail forwarding misconfigured into a loop,
so I sent it to the postmaster (and to fix the webmaster's mail alias).
Randy Davis
randy@agames.com
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Subject: Re: Single-receiver Accuracy
From: WhiteR@CRPL.Cedar-Rapids.lib.IA.US (Robert S. White)
Date: 13 Nov 1996 01:34:35 GMT
In article <56av3f$1rp@news.iastate.edu>, swormley@cnde.iastate.edu says...
   ...snip...
>Using the Acu-Lock feature on Trimble's ScoutMaster GPS receiver the
>following sample means (in meters) were collected. Each mean was derived
>from 38000 samples automatically collected over a 24-hour period. 
   ... a very reasonable/realistic set of measurements...
>"A measurement is worth a thousand expert opinions."
  Bravo Sam!  The actual measurement data you present here is IMHO, very
typical and correlates well with data/measurements that I have accumulated
over the last 10 years with various receivers.  Thanks for taking the time
to post this.
_______________________________________________________________________
Robert S. White                    -- an embedded sys software engineer
WhiteR@CRPL.Cedar-Rapids.lib.IA.US --long/cheap alternate I-net address
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Subject: Re: Looking for FAQ and product comparisons
From: slr@crl.com (S. Rennacker)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 19:16:49 -0800
I'm looking for something similar. My brother just bought a small 
aircraft with minimal navigation electronics and I'm 
thinking about buying him a GPS for Xmas. Unfortunately, I know almost 
nothing about them, and what to look for in an aircraft-compatible unit. 
I've noticed Magellan 4000s for about $250, which is the price range I'd 
consider...
Thanks!
slr@crl.com
gbynum@crossco.com 
wrote: : I hope to receive a portable GPS this Christmas.
: I want to know what I want!
: The primary use will be on a sailboat used in predominately
: coastal waters.  It will be used to supplement piloting and
: magnetic compass bearings for position determination.
: Are there FAQs to help me make my decision, or are there
: product comparisons.  If on the Internet, please advise
: sites where I should look.  If in a magazine, please pass
: that on as well.
: As I look, are there particular features which should be
: given special consideration?
: My news group access is very spotty; please reply via email.
: THANKS
: George W. Bynum
: gbynum@crossco.com
: -----------------------------------------------------------------------
: This article was posted to Usenet via the Posting Service at Deja News:
: http://www.dejanews.com/           [Search, Post, and Read Usenet News]
-- 
S. Rennacker (slr@crl.com) Berkeley, California
	-- Seconds for some after firsts for all. --
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Subject: Re: Looking for FAQ and product comparisons
From: slr@crl.com (S. Rennacker)
Date: 12 Nov 1996 19:16:49 -0800
I'm looking for something similar. My brother just bought a small 
aircraft with minimal navigation electronics and I'm 
thinking about buying him a GPS for Xmas. Unfortunately, I know almost 
nothing about them, and what to look for in an aircraft-compatible unit. 
I've noticed Magellan 4000s for about $250, which is the price range I'd 
consider...
Thanks!
slr@crl.com
gbynum@crossco.com 
wrote: : I hope to receive a portable GPS this Christmas.
: I want to know what I want!
: The primary use will be on a sailboat used in predominately
: coastal waters.  It will be used to supplement piloting and
: magnetic compass bearings for position determination.
: Are there FAQs to help me make my decision, or are there
: product comparisons.  If on the Internet, please advise
: sites where I should look.  If in a magazine, please pass
: that on as well.
: As I look, are there particular features which should be
: given special consideration?
: My news group access is very spotty; please reply via email.
: THANKS
: George W. Bynum
: gbynum@crossco.com
: -----------------------------------------------------------------------
: This article was posted to Usenet via the Posting Service at Deja News:
: http://www.dejanews.com/           [Search, Post, and Read Usenet News]
-- 
S. Rennacker (slr@crl.com) Berkeley, California
	-- Seconds for some after firsts for all. --
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Subject: Re: WGS-84
From: geo@geo-konzept.de (Thomas Muhr)
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 23:11:45 GMT
"Paul E. Remde"  wrote:
>I am looking for any information about WGS-84 (I may have it incorrect,
>it's a world model used when calculating distances).
>I want to know the actual equations used and how they're applied.
>I want to be able to calculate distances that are the same as those
>calculated by my gps.  It is for use in calculating distances flown in
>my glider.
You hardly have to know the precise datum for your application.
However the original source for WGS84 as well as for its relations to
other common datums for navigation and geodesy can be found in DMA
(Defense mapping agency, Systems Center, 8613 Lee Highway, Fairfax,
VA. 22031-2138) TR 8350.2 which is also including some Software for
conversion of ccordinates netween the datums.
Thomas
  Thomas Muhr        e-mail: geo@geo-konzept.de
geo-konzept GmbH        BBS: +49 8424 8989-90 (analog) or -91 (ISDN)
85111 Adelschlag        fax: +49 8424 8989-80
   Germany            voice: +49 8424 8989-0
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Subject: Re: Need Trimble protocol info
From: Paul Kronfield
Date: Tue, 12 Nov 1996 00:06:34 -0600
For information on Trimble GPS systems, turn to the premier GPS company
in the US - Mercat, Inc.  see http://www.mercat.com
Michael K.G. Venables wrote:
> 
> Hi Rex
> 
> TSIP - Trimble Serial Interface Protocol - has been around for awhile.
> Almost any current designers manual describes it and, as long as you stick
> with the "minimum output packets" and don't use the "super-packets" that
> are more recent, you should be OK. Order an SVeeSix-CM3 manual, part
> number27378-00 from 1-800-TRIMBLE.
> 
> --
> Regards
> 
> Mike Venables
> mikeve@stellarnav.com
> 45° 25' 19" N
> 75° 41' 47" W
> Check out our Web Site - http://www.stellarnav.com
> 
> Rex Allers  wrote in article
> <55ltqv$gip@news.nad.3com.com>...
> > Does anyone know if a description of the older Trimble communications
> protocol
> > is available somewhere?  What I am looking for is a standard serial
> > communication, but its not in ascii.  Its Trimble proprietary, I think
> its
> > called TSIP.
> >
> > I just acquired a Trimble unit thats about 5 yrs. old and I'd like to
> interface
> > some software to it (source level) that I already have.
> >
> > thanks for any help,
> > rex_allers@3com.com
> > KK6MK
> >
> >
--
Paul Kronfield
Houston, Texas, USA
pk@geoprobe.com
*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^
For Free Domestic and International faxes
see http://www.geoprobe.com
For Free stock quotations 
see http://www.petromoly.com
*******************************************
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Subject: Re: sextants etc.
From: Tony Sprent
Date: Wed, 13 Nov 1996 17:12:42 +1000
Donald Blakley wrote:
> > But it doesn't seem obvious to me that a plumb bob would point
> > the same direction as the normal.  On a sphere, of course it would,
> > but on an ellipsoid, does it?  It seems to me that it might point at
> > the center of the ellipsoid, or somewhere between that direction and
> > the normal.
> >
> > And what about variations in gravity caused by nearby masses like
> > mountains?  How much error would this cause?
> 
> The surveyors in the crowd may be the best ones to answer this but from a
> navigator's point of view here are some thoughts. You are quite right
> there is a geocentric and a geographic centre of the earth and they are
> not the same. However for the practical purposes of a navigator all is
> considered spherical. For example the stars are assumed to be all
> equidistant from the earth on the celestial sphere, as is the sun. The
> moon because of its proximity is a special case.
> 
> With a bubble sextant, certainly in a faster moving vehicle such as an
> aircraft coriolis (earth's rotational effect) on the bubble can be
> calculated and compensted for as is atmpspheric refraction etc. But no
> concern is shown by the navigator for errors which may be  introduced by the
> fact the earth is an oblate spheroid (slightly pear shaped). They for
> practical purposes are ignored. The surveyor has a slightly different
> problem and uses a transit I believe rather than a sextant, but I don't
> know how or if they correct for discrepency in determining the vertical. I
> believe they did however take numerous sights over a period to determine a
> datum which may have helped solve the problem.
> 
> Cheers
> DB
> --
There was quite an extensive discussion about this topic a few months
ago.
(Geodesists please note that some of what I say here is not absolutely
rigourous but is sufficient for the purposes of the discussion)
 Briefly, the earth's geopotential surface defined by sea level (geoid)
is very closely approximated by an ellipsoid of revolution (a sphere
which is flattened at the poles rather than pear shaped) because of the
combined forces of gravity and rotation about its axis. For all intents
and purposes the normal to the ellipsoid is the same as the direction
defined by the vertical as indicated by a plumb bob or spirit level
anywhere on the surface of the earth. (The difference between the two is
called the deflection of the vertical and seldom gets bigger than a
minute of arc.) It is for this reason that an ellipsoid is used as a
reference surface for describing position.
Since astronomical observations for lat and long are based on vertical
angles measured with respect to the local vertical there is no need to
consider the flattening or eccentricity provided we define our position
in terms of latitude and longitude. It is only when we need to convert
position into projection coordinates (UTM etc) or determine our position
using GPS etc that we need to consider the shape of the reference
ellipsoid. 
__________________________________________________________
| Tony Sprent                                             |
| Department of Surveying & Spatial Information Science   |
| University of Tasmania                                  |
| GPO Box 252C Hobart        _--_|\                       |
| Tasmania*                 /      \                      |
| Australia   7001          \_.--._/   )                  |
|                                 *   /                   |
| Phone 61-3-62262106 Fax 61-3-62240282  International    |
|         03-62262106       03-62240282  Australia        |
| email  Tony.Sprent@surv.utas.edu.au                     |
| http://info.utas.edu.au/docs/geomatics/		  |
|_________________________________________________________|
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Subject: Re: Rockwell protocol
From: jvaline@isle.net (Jeff Valine)
Date: Wed, 13 Nov 1996 04:30:00 GMT
WhiteR@CRPL.Cedar-Rapids.lib.IA.US (Robert S. White) wrote:
>In article <3286A63F.B88@isle.net>, jvaline@isle.net says...
>>
>>                             However, it does include the
>>INTER-RCVR interaction, right?  I mean the definition of all of the flag
>>word bits, and the definition of how messages are used, ie: INTER sends
>>CONNECT, RCVR sends ACK, RCVR sends ACCEPT, INTER sends ACK, RCVR sends
>                                             ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^           .
>>messages.
>  I certainly agree with that.  It takes careful reading of the spec to
>do the appropriate handshake logic as requested by what flag bits are
>set.  Only send back and ACK or NAK if ACK_Requested was set.  Only send
>back a handshake Command Accept or Command Reject if Handshake_Requested
>was set.  The receiver normally does not set these request bits, whereas
>the sender (INTER in your lingo) is supposed to set these bits.
>  The "INTER sends ACK" part you describe above (in the CONNECT as message 
>block protocol sequence) is really not necessary and is normally not done, 
>that is, not requested by the RCVR. 
Well, that example I gave is what I see when I use a PLGR with the
Rockwell MPS for DOS software, turn on message logging, and CONNECT a
message #3 (Timemark).  I know the PLGR doesn't actually need the last
ACK from the sender (it will start sending data anyway), but it does
set the ACK_Requested bit in the ACCEPT message (As is specified in
ICD-GPS-153).
-----------
Jeff Valine
jvaline@isle.net
http://www.isle.net/~jvaline
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Subject: Re: What AUTOMATIC track mode mean
From: caveman@castles.com (Mikey)
Date: Wed, 13 Nov 1996 05:10:41 GMT
Garmin will output a track point when you change speed a few
miles/hour or when you change direction by some number of degrees when
in automatic mode.  I have seen it go for a LONG time without
outputting a point when speed is relatively constant and little or no
change in direction.  They claim this is the best selection but my
GPS-90 fills up all 2048 locations on a trip between San Francisco and
L.A.  I have to switch to 30 second mode on the highway to keep it
within limits.
Mike
    _/_/    _/_/    _/   _/  _/    _/_/_/_/    From the cave of:
   _/ _/  _/ _/    _/   _/ _/     _/          Mike/AB6NN
  _/  _/_/  _/    _/   _/_/      _/_/_/      Caveman@Castles.com
 _/   _/   _/    _/   _/  _/    _/          Fully MIME capable
_/        _/    _/   _/    _/  _/_/_/_/_/  at 38.05.55N, 122.12.24W
Of all the things that stay the same, clouds change the most.
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